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Wandering Adventure Party

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  3. What Would It Take for Canada to Build Its Own Fighter Jets Again?

What Would It Take for Canada to Build Its Own Fighter Jets Again?

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Canada
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  • DominoD Domino
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    orteilgenou@lemmy.world
    wrote on last edited by
    #3

    The future is in drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

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    • DominoD Domino
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      breezeblock@lemmy.ca
      wrote on last edited by
      #4

      The real concern is not “which aircraft to buy” — its “in 20 years will Canada be able to even arm itself in a world of disrupted supply chains?”

      Agreed that drones are tactically important, but tanks and fighters ships are strategically important, and will never go out of style.

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      • O orteilgenou@lemmy.world

        The future is in drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

        P This user is from outside of this forum
        P This user is from outside of this forum
        Pennomi
        wrote on last edited by
        #5

        Until someone comes up with a very compelling anti-drone countermeasure, drones are basically the ideal weapon for a battlefield. Cheap, mobile, can loiter, good recon, etc.

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • DominoD Domino
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          hertzdentalbar@lemmy.blahaj.zone
          wrote on last edited by
          #6

          Drones are the future, fuck building fighters or bombers.

          H C 2 Replies Last reply
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          • H hertzdentalbar@lemmy.blahaj.zone

            Drones are the future, fuck building fighters or bombers.

            H This user is from outside of this forum
            H This user is from outside of this forum
            hellsbelle@sh.itjust.works
            wrote on last edited by
            #7

            Drones can’t defend the Arctic. In fact they’d be fairly useless to most of Canada that doesn’t sit within the 49th-50th parallel.

            H 1 Reply Last reply
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            • H hellsbelle@sh.itjust.works

              Drones can’t defend the Arctic. In fact they’d be fairly useless to most of Canada that doesn’t sit within the 49th-50th parallel.

              H This user is from outside of this forum
              H This user is from outside of this forum
              hertzdentalbar@lemmy.blahaj.zone
              wrote on last edited by
              #8

              You know you can launch satilites that cover the arctic right? Or you making some claim about the cold and the batteries.

              H 1 Reply Last reply
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              • H hertzdentalbar@lemmy.blahaj.zone

                You know you can launch satilites that cover the arctic right? Or you making some claim about the cold and the batteries.

                H This user is from outside of this forum
                H This user is from outside of this forum
                hellsbelle@sh.itjust.works
                wrote on last edited by
                #9

                At -60C not much works well.

                C 1 Reply Last reply
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                • B breezeblock@lemmy.ca

                  The real concern is not “which aircraft to buy” — its “in 20 years will Canada be able to even arm itself in a world of disrupted supply chains?”

                  Agreed that drones are tactically important, but tanks and fighters ships are strategically important, and will never go out of style.

                  R This user is from outside of this forum
                  R This user is from outside of this forum
                  rekabis@lemmy.ca
                  wrote on last edited by rekabis@lemmy.ca
                  #10

                  Which is why we really need to build cheap, simple, and purposeful aircraft. We need to move away from “everything AND the kitchen sink” aircraft, as multiple conflicting roles frequently reduce an aircraft’s effectiveness in any one role. Have five completely different fighter aircraft, if necessary, in order to ensure we can continue to maintain them via simplicity and ease of parts manufacturing. And to be able to drop an entire model to focus on the remaining ones, if necessary.

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                  • BaroqueInMindB BaroqueInMind

                    It would take billions of tax payer dollars and decades

                    C This user is from outside of this forum
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                    cyborganism
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #11

                    The money is there. The Weston family and other billionaires are all holding it.

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                    • B breezeblock@lemmy.ca

                      The real concern is not “which aircraft to buy” — its “in 20 years will Canada be able to even arm itself in a world of disrupted supply chains?”

                      Agreed that drones are tactically important, but tanks and fighters ships are strategically important, and will never go out of style.

                      U This user is from outside of this forum
                      U This user is from outside of this forum
                      ulrich_the_old@lemmy.ca
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #12

                      I have seen plenty of tanks and ships crippled or destroyed by drones…

                      1 Reply Last reply
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                      • DominoD Domino
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                        fleur_@aussie.zone
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #13

                        Deep pockets and a spine

                        C C 2 Replies Last reply
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                        • F fleur_@aussie.zone

                          Deep pockets and a spine

                          C This user is from outside of this forum
                          C This user is from outside of this forum
                          canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #14

                          The cost isn’t actually much higher for the Gripen proposal this is about, although I’m not sure if that leaves things like the actual factories out.

                          1 Reply Last reply
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                          • O orteilgenou@lemmy.world

                            The future is in drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

                            C This user is from outside of this forum
                            C This user is from outside of this forum
                            canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #15

                            I’ve wondered about just SAMs and MANPADs as an alternative to any new fighter jet. We can’t really trust the F-35 and the alternatives (the Gripen E) might not be survivable, depending on a bunch of data I don’t have.

                            Sure, they can’t be used offensively, but that’s not the main thing I worry about in the near future.

                            1 Reply Last reply
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                            • H hellsbelle@sh.itjust.works

                              At -60C not much works well.

                              C This user is from outside of this forum
                              C This user is from outside of this forum
                              canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                              wrote on last edited by canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                              #16

                              I mean, -60 is extremely unusual even in the high arctic, but the point stands at “just” -40.

                              It’s usually more a matter of designers not bothering with severe cold conditions than any fundamental issue. In a pinch, I imagine just getting an FPV drone up to temperature in a tent or sleeping bag would give you a bit of range. For more, you’d need to insulate it and add a little internal heater, but that seems doable.

                              Most of what happens in the arctic is going to involve long-distance gas (or nuclear) powered equipment anyway. It’s big and sparsely populated.

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • H hertzdentalbar@lemmy.blahaj.zone

                                Drones are the future, fuck building fighters or bombers.

                                C This user is from outside of this forum
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                                canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                                wrote on last edited by canadaplus@lemmy.sdf.org
                                #17

                                Sort of? Existing software isn’t smart enough to fight a battle on it’s own, and electronic warfare is a real thing that makes communications hard. In a full-blown war situation there’s appeal in having a human being in a cockpit close to possible targets.

                                The things we worry about in Canada are more specific, though. For example, we probably don’t need long-range bombers of our own.

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                                • BaroqueInMindB BaroqueInMind

                                  It would take billions of tax payer dollars and decades

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                                  H This user is from outside of this forum
                                  hacksaw@lemmy.ca
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #18

                                  No more than what we’re spending on the F35. We could design 10 new aircraft for that price

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                                  0
                                  • F fleur_@aussie.zone

                                    Deep pockets and a spine

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                                    corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #19

                                    And time. Don’t forget time.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • O orteilgenou@lemmy.world

                                      The future is in drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

                                      C This user is from outside of this forum
                                      C This user is from outside of this forum
                                      corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #20

                                      drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

                                      ECM says what?

                                      F 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • C corsicanguppy@lemmy.ca

                                        drones. If Canada should sink funding into anything, it should be that.

                                        ECM says what?

                                        F This user is from outside of this forum
                                        F This user is from outside of this forum
                                        fnord@lemmy.ca
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #21

                                        Fibre optic drone says hi.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0

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