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  3. Apparently Canadians are notorius cheaters in the sport of Curling

Apparently Canadians are notorius cheaters in the sport of Curling

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Canada
canada
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  • tomiantT tomiant

    A tiny finger poke makes a ton of difference apparently, which is precisely why it’s forbidden. You’ve got a 45 meter long track, small adjustments matter a lot. Though honestly I cannot believe I am letting myself getting worked up over fucking curling.

    I guess it’s just the reaction to people cheating at the highest competitive levels and then have the gall to be fucking abrasive assholes about it.

    Value SubtractedV This user is from outside of this forum
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    Value Subtracted
    wrote on last edited by
    #26

    Having curled myself, I can assure you it does not…and if it did make a difference, it would almost certainly be negative, since you’re giving up any semblance of control that you had on the actual throw. There’s not going to be some “precision poke” that magically steers it where it needs to go. But don’t take my word for it.

    Does it make any difference?

    “No. The double-touching that I’ve seen has been incidental contact, and that’s fingers brushing or hand brushing on a 40-pound piece of granite,” said Eugene Hritzuk, a Canadian curler based in Saskatoon who has been involved in competitive curling and coaching for more than 60 years.

    “What can fingers brushing against a 40-pound piece of granite do in any event? You need the palm on your hand against that stone to do anything.”

    Delivering a stone entails acute skills to slide on line and on pace, he said.

    Once sliding on target and at the right speed, releasing the stone and then touching it with any force would cause it to veer off its intended line and speed, Hritzuk said. “That would not be advantageous to good execution.”

    Canadian curling commentator John Cullen, who hosted the CBC podcast Broomgate: A Curling Scandal, said most top curlers will say that double-touching has no effect on the stone.

    As well, most top curlers will double-touch at times and don’t think it’s a foul, he said.

    “The idea that a top curler would let a rock go and then want to try to adjust it with their finger —it doesn’t seem like there’s any way you could get an advantage from that. It feels like it would be worse.”

    But as I said, the rules are the rules, and I don’t think it’s wrong to enforce them.

    tomiantT S BuelldozerB 3 Replies Last reply
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    • Value SubtractedV Value Subtracted

      Having curled myself, I can assure you it does not…and if it did make a difference, it would almost certainly be negative, since you’re giving up any semblance of control that you had on the actual throw. There’s not going to be some “precision poke” that magically steers it where it needs to go. But don’t take my word for it.

      Does it make any difference?

      “No. The double-touching that I’ve seen has been incidental contact, and that’s fingers brushing or hand brushing on a 40-pound piece of granite,” said Eugene Hritzuk, a Canadian curler based in Saskatoon who has been involved in competitive curling and coaching for more than 60 years.

      “What can fingers brushing against a 40-pound piece of granite do in any event? You need the palm on your hand against that stone to do anything.”

      Delivering a stone entails acute skills to slide on line and on pace, he said.

      Once sliding on target and at the right speed, releasing the stone and then touching it with any force would cause it to veer off its intended line and speed, Hritzuk said. “That would not be advantageous to good execution.”

      Canadian curling commentator John Cullen, who hosted the CBC podcast Broomgate: A Curling Scandal, said most top curlers will say that double-touching has no effect on the stone.

      As well, most top curlers will double-touch at times and don’t think it’s a foul, he said.

      “The idea that a top curler would let a rock go and then want to try to adjust it with their finger —it doesn’t seem like there’s any way you could get an advantage from that. It feels like it would be worse.”

      But as I said, the rules are the rules, and I don’t think it’s wrong to enforce them.

      tomiantT This user is from outside of this forum
      tomiantT This user is from outside of this forum
      tomiant
      wrote on last edited by
      #27

      It’s strange then how this is a common strategy among cheaters in curling, and that it is exactly what the Canadian team is known for, and it is illegal to do for precisely that reason.

      Value SubtractedV D 2 Replies Last reply
      33
      • N NotSteve_

        We’re not sending our best [to the Olympics] 😞

        S This user is from outside of this forum
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        shittydwarf@sh.itjust.works
        wrote on last edited by
        #28

        Yep not impressed with this display of poor sportsmanship

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • T toiletobserver

          That does seem like solid proof

          B This user is from outside of this forum
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          bcsven@lemmy.ca
          wrote on last edited by
          #29

          Its a snapshot, he could have released this handle and retracted his hand with his finger off to side of the tangent of the rock. Wed need frames before and after for better review

          B 1 Reply Last reply
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          • tomiantT tomiant

            It’s strange then how this is a common strategy among cheaters in curling, and that it is exactly what the Canadian team is known for, and it is illegal to do for precisely that reason.

            Value SubtractedV This user is from outside of this forum
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            Value Subtracted
            wrote on last edited by
            #30

            this is a common strategy among cheaters in curling

            Very confidently stated, but I really don’t think it is.

            it is illegal to do for precisely that reason.

            It’s illegal because it’s way simpler to implement a “no touching” rule than to try to define game-changing and non game-changing touches in a way that would be enforceable.

            And again, I have absolutely no problem with the rule being enforced, even though I don’t think for a hot second that it impacted the game.

            W 1 Reply Last reply
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            • tomiantT tomiant

              Yes I am a violent drug addicted criminal, I don’t know maybe you’re a nice kid in school and wear shirts and stuff but around my hood we don’t.

              G This user is from outside of this forum
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              gregorgizeh@lemmy.zip
              wrote on last edited by
              #31

              You realize we are not in your hood

              tomiantT 1 Reply Last reply
              15
              • B bcsven@lemmy.ca

                Its a snapshot, he could have released this handle and retracted his hand with his finger off to side of the tangent of the rock. Wed need frames before and after for better review

                B This user is from outside of this forum
                B This user is from outside of this forum
                bcsven@lemmy.ca
                wrote on last edited by
                #32

                Well in the slowed video it totally looks intentional https://youtu.be/W1yh6GN5ysks

                L 1 Reply Last reply
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                • Value SubtractedV Value Subtracted

                  …if said billiard ball weighed 40 lbs.

                  A little finger poke ain’t gonna do shit.

                  But, the rules are the rules.

                  N This user is from outside of this forum
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                  njm1314@lemmy.world
                  wrote on last edited by njm1314@lemmy.world
                  #33

                  I can’t imagine why people think it wouldn’t have an effect. This is a sport where brooms have an effect. Why wouldn’t a push have an effect? And if it had no effect why do they do it?

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                  • Z zjti8eit@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                    cross-posted from: https://hexbear.net/post/7671573

                    Sweden knew Canada’s Marc Kennedy was a notorious cheater.

                    So they set up a camera at the ‘hog line’ to record it.

                    And caught him doing it at the Olympics.

                    tweto

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                    njm1314@lemmy.world
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #34

                    I believe they’ve been caught three times at minimum now, and for all I know more now by today. The men’s team was caught twice and the women’s team was got once.

                    1 Reply Last reply
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                    • T thorry@feddit.org

                      There is a line after which they are no longer allowed to touch the stone. The handles on the stone have sensors on it, to detect a touch after the line and call foul. But the Canadians touched the stone itself, not the handles. Which isn’t a legal move, but isn’t automatically detected. And with how they did it, the refs didn’t see it right away.

                      Edit: Correction, it doesn’t actually matter if it’s before or after the hog line, once the handle is released on the stone nobody is allowed to touch it anymore. The release has to be before the hog line, but there is no touching after that regardless of where the stone is.

                      Dr. BobD This user is from outside of this forum
                      Dr. BobD This user is from outside of this forum
                      Dr. Bob
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #35

                      The rules are silent on touching the stone. They are clear about not touching the handle. I don’t disagree with you, but the granite is not the handle.

                      1 Reply Last reply
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                      • N njm1314@lemmy.world

                        I can’t imagine why people think it wouldn’t have an effect. This is a sport where brooms have an effect. Why wouldn’t a push have an effect? And if it had no effect why do they do it?

                        Value SubtractedV This user is from outside of this forum
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                        Value Subtracted
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #36

                        The brooms affect the ice in front of the rock, which changes the rock’s behaviour as it moves over the swept patch. You have to exert quite a bit of force to push the rock directly.

                        And if it had no effect why do they do it?

                        Sometimes by accident, I’m sure. And probably more relevant, sometimes out of sheer laziness.

                        khannie@lemmy.worldK N 2 Replies Last reply
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                        • Z zjti8eit@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                          cross-posted from: https://hexbear.net/post/7671573

                          Sweden knew Canada’s Marc Kennedy was a notorious cheater.

                          So they set up a camera at the ‘hog line’ to record it.

                          And caught him doing it at the Olympics.

                          tweto

                          Link Preview Image
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                          glide@lemmy.ca
                          wrote on last edited by glide@lemmy.ca
                          #37

                          I trust whatever committee they have at the Olympics to make the judgement on this, but if our team is cheating, fuck those guys.

                          Yes, there’s some redactionist arguments about how it “doesn’t actually impact the rock,” but fuck that. We have a codified rule that specifically says you can’t do it, and these athletes are playing at literally the highest level that exists. They know better and have had time to practice better. If they’re cheating at the Olympics, I hope it follows them forever.

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                          • S sepia@mander.xyz

                            That’s cheap anti-Western propaganda provided by hexbear.

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                            glide@lemmy.ca
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #38

                            I mean, fuck Hexbear, but this is in fact all over the news. I’m sure it’s posted there in an anti-west bias, but that doesn’t make it untrue, and I absolutely demand better from my country than to cheat at the Olympics.

                            F S 2 Replies Last reply
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                            • Value SubtractedV Value Subtracted

                              The brooms affect the ice in front of the rock, which changes the rock’s behaviour as it moves over the swept patch. You have to exert quite a bit of force to push the rock directly.

                              And if it had no effect why do they do it?

                              Sometimes by accident, I’m sure. And probably more relevant, sometimes out of sheer laziness.

                              khannie@lemmy.worldK This user is from outside of this forum
                              khannie@lemmy.worldK This user is from outside of this forum
                              khannie@lemmy.world
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #39

                              Ah let’s be honest here… That was neither laziness nor accidental.

                              Value SubtractedV 1 Reply Last reply
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                              • G glide@lemmy.ca

                                I trust whatever committee they have at the Olympics to make the judgement on this, but if our team is cheating, fuck those guys.

                                Yes, there’s some redactionist arguments about how it “doesn’t actually impact the rock,” but fuck that. We have a codified rule that specifically says you can’t do it, and these athletes are playing at literally the highest level that exists. They know better and have had time to practice better. If they’re cheating at the Olympics, I hope it follows them forever.

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                                aim_at_me@lemmy.nz
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #40

                                If it doesn’t impact the rock, then why do they risk breaking the rules to do it?

                                G S 2 Replies Last reply
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                                • A aim_at_me@lemmy.nz

                                  If it doesn’t impact the rock, then why do they risk breaking the rules to do it?

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                                  glide@lemmy.ca
                                  wrote on last edited by glide@lemmy.ca
                                  #41

                                  Because extreme cases can impact the rock. Barely touching the rock in the way caught on film realistically isn’t impacting the rock, but the rule needs to exist to prevent someone from actively pushing the rock after letting go.

                                  But again, these guys know better and have had the time and resources to train better.

                                  wraithgear@lemmy.worldW B 2 Replies Last reply
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                                  • khannie@lemmy.worldK khannie@lemmy.world

                                    Ah let’s be honest here… That was neither laziness nor accidental.

                                    Value SubtractedV This user is from outside of this forum
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                                    Value Subtracted
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #42

                                    Look, I find extending a finger to give the stone a boop after release completely baffling…but there’s no chance at all that it affected the trajectory of the thing. You might as well “cheat” by blowing on it.

                                    khannie@lemmy.worldK S 2 Replies Last reply
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                                    • A aim_at_me@lemmy.nz

                                      If it doesn’t impact the rock, then why do they risk breaking the rules to do it?

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                                      savethetuahawk@lemmy.ca
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #43

                                      It can prevent over-rotation of the rock. He knew exactly what he was doing.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • Value SubtractedV Value Subtracted

                                        …if said billiard ball weighed 40 lbs.

                                        A little finger poke ain’t gonna do shit.

                                        But, the rules are the rules.

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                                        savethetuahawk@lemmy.ca
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #44

                                        A little finger poke ain’t gonna do shit.

                                        a slight drag will prevent over -rotation of the stone.

                                        Regardless, it’s a fucking rule.

                                        Value SubtractedV 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • S savethetuahawk@lemmy.ca

                                          A little finger poke ain’t gonna do shit.

                                          a slight drag will prevent over -rotation of the stone.

                                          Regardless, it’s a fucking rule.

                                          Value SubtractedV This user is from outside of this forum
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                                          Value Subtracted
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #45

                                          I have said several time that I have no problem with the rule being enforced.

                                          a slight drag will prevent over -rotation of the stone.

                                          I really don’t think so, especially the light touch that I’ve seen on video (which, to be fair, was Homan’s throw on the women’s side). Again, these things are damn heavy, and you’re not going to push them around with a finger without making a visible effort.

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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