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  3. Constitutional right to a wild garden with weeds and bees to be tested in Ontario court

Constitutional right to a wild garden with weeds and bees to be tested in Ontario court

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Canada
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  • lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.caL lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca

    Ragweed can burn in hell.

    ryan213@lemmy.caR This user is from outside of this forum
    ryan213@lemmy.caR This user is from outside of this forum
    ryan213@lemmy.ca
    wrote on last edited by
    #24

    F yeah, allergy brother/sister!

    1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • 9 9488fcea02a9@sh.itjust.works

      The term “weed” is stupid. Arbitrarily deciding that certain native plants are undesirable is such a colonizer mindset

      Binzy_BoiB This user is from outside of this forum
      Binzy_BoiB This user is from outside of this forum
      Binzy_Boi
      wrote on last edited by
      #25

      I think the term is fine if you approach it from an “invasive species” mindset rather than an “undesirable” mindset.

      I don’t know if it was intentionally done by my teachers, but that’s the impression I always got about the term since it was usually brought up in the context of introduced species of plants causing harm to native species. Stuff like dandelions and such.

      D W 2 Replies Last reply
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      • K k_rol

        Damn I hope they win against the city. The typical law has to die, it’s ridiculously useless and detrimental to biodiversity.

        Why should we have to maintain one type of plant which has problems surviving without lots of upkeep?

        M This user is from outside of this forum
        M This user is from outside of this forum
        mpatch@lemmy.world
        wrote on last edited by
        #26

        Yes but also no. I agree but there is a big grain of salt to be had here. Yards like also help pests thrive too. Particularly ticks and rodents come to mind. Lots of hiding areas that are safe for rodents to avoid seen / caught. Easy safe pathways for skunks, raccoons, possums etc. Ticks are gona love the tall plants and moist conditions. Earwigs are gona be all up in almost everything that is there. If there is anything that grows fruit, well you vet your ass theres gona be way more paper wasps/balshead hornets/ yellow jackets etc. Is the increased pollen going to now cause more allergies for 8 year old Timmy next door? When winter rolls around all those wonderfull bugs and critters 100% gona want to cozy up in your 2000sqft home. From attic, basment, or kitchen Cupboard.

        Eveyone seems to miss the fact that a diverse environment doesn’t only just attract bees and Butterflies. It wouldn’t be "diverse " if it did.

        The big reason we grow grass and keep it short is for pest control.

        B 1 Reply Last reply
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        • paraphrandP paraphrand

          Based Karen.

          quick_snail@feddit.nlQ This user is from outside of this forum
          quick_snail@feddit.nlQ This user is from outside of this forum
          quick_snail@feddit.nl
          wrote on last edited by
          #27

          Cept for all those other Karens

          1 Reply Last reply
          2
          • M mpatch@lemmy.world

            Yes but also no. I agree but there is a big grain of salt to be had here. Yards like also help pests thrive too. Particularly ticks and rodents come to mind. Lots of hiding areas that are safe for rodents to avoid seen / caught. Easy safe pathways for skunks, raccoons, possums etc. Ticks are gona love the tall plants and moist conditions. Earwigs are gona be all up in almost everything that is there. If there is anything that grows fruit, well you vet your ass theres gona be way more paper wasps/balshead hornets/ yellow jackets etc. Is the increased pollen going to now cause more allergies for 8 year old Timmy next door? When winter rolls around all those wonderfull bugs and critters 100% gona want to cozy up in your 2000sqft home. From attic, basment, or kitchen Cupboard.

            Eveyone seems to miss the fact that a diverse environment doesn’t only just attract bees and Butterflies. It wouldn’t be "diverse " if it did.

            The big reason we grow grass and keep it short is for pest control.

            B This user is from outside of this forum
            B This user is from outside of this forum
            bussygyatt@feddit.org
            wrote on last edited by
            #28

            ignoring the obvious fact that you’re effectively declaring entire clades of sentient animals to be basically biological waste because i know im going to make exactly zero headway with a human supremacist in this comment; if the primary consideration were pests, wouldn’t stones or pavement be a more ideal solution than grass with all the maintenance and upkeep that requires being baked into the law?

            heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH M A 3 Replies Last reply
            13
            • B bussygyatt@feddit.org

              ignoring the obvious fact that you’re effectively declaring entire clades of sentient animals to be basically biological waste because i know im going to make exactly zero headway with a human supremacist in this comment; if the primary consideration were pests, wouldn’t stones or pavement be a more ideal solution than grass with all the maintenance and upkeep that requires being baked into the law?

              heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH This user is from outside of this forum
              heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH This user is from outside of this forum
              heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.world
              wrote on last edited by
              #29

              i feel comfortable declaring centipedes, you know those ones that look like eyelashes? those are biological waste because they freak me the fuck out. every time i see one i have nightmares for a week i’m going to wake up with beautiful gorgeous long eyelashes, but they’ll turn out to just be centipedes with a thing for my eye juices. if they have any other purpose in the universe than giving me eye juice nightmares i don’t want to hear it

              C 1 Reply Last reply
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              • C compactflax@discuss.tchncs.de

                Wonder how much this fruitless battle is costing taxpayers.

                L This user is from outside of this forum
                L This user is from outside of this forum
                lyrl@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                wrote on last edited by
                #30

                Unfortunately many tax payers will support it, because non-standard property appearance drags down property values. Or people just get their panties twisted by stuff. Some of my city’s aldermen are trying to make it illegal to grow corn (technically “vegetable gardens over six feet tall”) in city limits because they have gotten so many complaints from neighbors. Having a food plant visible near a residence? The horror!

                M 1 Reply Last reply
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                • heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.world

                  i feel comfortable declaring centipedes, you know those ones that look like eyelashes? those are biological waste because they freak me the fuck out. every time i see one i have nightmares for a week i’m going to wake up with beautiful gorgeous long eyelashes, but they’ll turn out to just be centipedes with a thing for my eye juices. if they have any other purpose in the universe than giving me eye juice nightmares i don’t want to hear it

                  C This user is from outside of this forum
                  C This user is from outside of this forum
                  calpal@lemmy.ca
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #31

                  Oh, are you talking about House Centipedes? Great for controlling other insects in your house!

                  And also, at my current phase in my life, the closest thing I’ll have to some creature cuddling me at night.

                  heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH 1 Reply Last reply
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                  • B bussygyatt@feddit.org

                    ignoring the obvious fact that you’re effectively declaring entire clades of sentient animals to be basically biological waste because i know im going to make exactly zero headway with a human supremacist in this comment; if the primary consideration were pests, wouldn’t stones or pavement be a more ideal solution than grass with all the maintenance and upkeep that requires being baked into the law?

                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                    mpatch@lemmy.world
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #32

                    Grass seed is significantly cheaper and faster than stones and pavement. Grass also provides some water retention during rain, helping reduce demand on storm drains.

                    Yes you will not make headway with this human supremacist for the fact that I have zero interest in paying thousands of dollars in repairs. Because some coon decided to live in my crawl space and fuck my shit up. Or worse yet, have a rat chew up wires and burn my house down. Fun fact, rats love the texture of Romex wire on their teeth.

                    B 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • C calpal@lemmy.ca

                      Oh, are you talking about House Centipedes? Great for controlling other insects in your house!

                      And also, at my current phase in my life, the closest thing I’ll have to some creature cuddling me at night.

                      heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH This user is from outside of this forum
                      heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.worldH This user is from outside of this forum
                      heythisisnttheymca@lemmy.world
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #33

                      i use wolf spiders for house insect control. currently Gary is on duty

                      T 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • B bcsven@lemmy.ca

                        Yeah, we have some good things, besides “free” healthcare.

                        The closest thing to an HOA in Canada is when it is a shared building like a Condo, then we have a Strata.

                        It runs as a legal corporation, with some property (such as building, roof being common property, and some outdoor spaces being shared or limited common property) the difference is each year you get to vote in a new council (if people want the role) and changes to bylaws are voted on as a majority by the owners. Minor things 51% majority, major changes are 75% majority.

                        So if something like a “no yellow doors” policy bothers you, you just propose a motion to allow yellow as a building scheme for doors, and hope enough residents agree. Since the housing market where I live has such a high resell rate, its rare you’d be stuck with the same ultra staunch voters for every council.

                        S This user is from outside of this forum
                        S This user is from outside of this forum
                        sexybenfranklin@ttrpg.network
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #34

                        That’s literally just an HOA, but only for multi-tenant buildings. Like, I get that you don’t have them for detached single family homes, but every aspect you’re describing is just how HOAs function in the US.

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                        • streetfestival@lemmy.caS streetfestival@lemmy.ca

                          A Burlington homeowner is fighting charges over her “naturalized garden” of native plants in her front and back yards. The city is taking Karen Barnes to Provincial Offences Court, seeking up to $400,000 in fines for violating a bylaw order to cut it down.

                          Barnes is challenging the case on constitutional grounds, arguing her right to freedom of expression through gardening is protected under the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

                          She says her garden supports pollinators, biodiversity and wildlife, reflecting her environmental and spiritual beliefs. She appeared for a pre-trial hearing on Wednesday and is scheduled for a two-day trial in November, according to her lawyer, Vilko Zbogar.

                          Zbogar says the case is about more than the fine. “Courts have recognized since at least 1996 that freedom of expression under the Charter protects natural gardens as expressions of profound environmental values,” he said. “For Karen, it’s also a spiritual exercise — tied to her creed and beliefs. This falls under Sections 2(a) and 2(b) of the Charter: freedom of conscience and religion and freedom of expression.”

                          Experts say naturalized gardens and meadows can attract far more pollinators than regularly mown lawns, while also using less water and improving soil health.

                          Link Preview Image
                          Constitutional right to a wild garden with weeds and bees to be tested in Ontario court

                          A Burlington homeowner is fighting charges over her “naturalized garden” of native plants in her front and back yards. The city is taking Karen Barnes to Provincial Offences Court, seeking up to $400,000 in fines for violating a bylaw order to cut it down.

                          favicon

                          Canada's National Observer (www.nationalobserver.com)

                          N This user is from outside of this forum
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                          njm1314@lemmy.world
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #35

                          400,000 in fines? Fuck them. Even if I disagreed with her argument I would still agree with her for that alone. That’s just obscene.

                          1 Reply Last reply
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                          • M mpatch@lemmy.world

                            Grass seed is significantly cheaper and faster than stones and pavement. Grass also provides some water retention during rain, helping reduce demand on storm drains.

                            Yes you will not make headway with this human supremacist for the fact that I have zero interest in paying thousands of dollars in repairs. Because some coon decided to live in my crawl space and fuck my shit up. Or worse yet, have a rat chew up wires and burn my house down. Fun fact, rats love the texture of Romex wire on their teeth.

                            B This user is from outside of this forum
                            B This user is from outside of this forum
                            bussygyatt@feddit.org
                            wrote on last edited by bussygyatt@feddit.org
                            #36

                            this human supremacist

                            i take it back. i made a very small amount of headway with a human supremacist

                            edit: “coon” tasteful, bud. fun fact, humans love the texture of gunmetal in their hands. hey have you considered maybe its your fault for living in a house that’s not built to resist invasion? modern materials and construction techniques work wonders in allowing humans to pretend the natural world they’re raping for resources doesn’t exist. but no, it must be the animals seeking shelter, they must be murdered for their inconvenient audacity of wanting to be fucking alive. because you have zero interest in paying for any alternative solutions. it’s not in your interest to have empathy for other living creatures. empathy is a sin. you didnt rape all those resources just to spend them on anything or anyone else. those resources are for you. that’s why god put those animals there and you in charge of them, because you know best.

                            i hope you seek shelter and are murdered for the attempt by someone who looks at you the same way you look at a rat.

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                            • S sexybenfranklin@ttrpg.network

                              That’s literally just an HOA, but only for multi-tenant buildings. Like, I get that you don’t have them for detached single family homes, but every aspect you’re describing is just how HOAs function in the US.

                              B This user is from outside of this forum
                              B This user is from outside of this forum
                              bcsven@lemmy.ca
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #37

                              Some HOA documentaries I have seen about USA had them own the house or have right of sale refusal, and can have a say in who buys the property, with a strata here the sale is owner to owner, and strata is not involved other than notification and identification. You are bound by the bylaws created by fellow owners, but since Strata doesn’t get a say in the sale there is possibility for new buyers coming in to flip the old owners rules quite soon.

                              1 Reply Last reply
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                              • 9 9488fcea02a9@sh.itjust.works

                                The term “weed” is stupid. Arbitrarily deciding that certain native plants are undesirable is such a colonizer mindset

                                T This user is from outside of this forum
                                T This user is from outside of this forum
                                tollana1234567@lemmy.today
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #38

                                they usually use the term noxious weeds

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                                • S sreudianflip@sh.itjust.works

                                  It’s also, in the simplest way, incompetent.

                                  All those weeds provide some ecological service in some way. If you look at my yard and note it’s covered in tall straggly white flowers, you could say weedy, and be right. I would clarify that wild carrots are helping convert our heavy clay soil into good tilth, and supporting a massive number of pollinators and pest predators.

                                  And why would we put up with yellow dock going to seed everywhere? It’s the most nutritious chicken fodder, and it also gives tilth to heavy clay.

                                  Don’t get me started about dandelion!!

                                  T This user is from outside of this forum
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                                  tollana1234567@lemmy.today
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #39

                                  there is even non-native plants that naturalized, but not invasive.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.caL lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca

                                    Ragweed can burn in hell.

                                    T This user is from outside of this forum
                                    T This user is from outside of this forum
                                    tollana1234567@lemmy.today
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #40

                                    kudzu, ivy, and any vine plants. although kudzu is now being combatted with the weevil.

                                    1 Reply Last reply
                                    2
                                    • L lyrl@lemmy.dbzer0.com

                                      Unfortunately many tax payers will support it, because non-standard property appearance drags down property values. Or people just get their panties twisted by stuff. Some of my city’s aldermen are trying to make it illegal to grow corn (technically “vegetable gardens over six feet tall”) in city limits because they have gotten so many complaints from neighbors. Having a food plant visible near a residence? The horror!

                                      M This user is from outside of this forum
                                      M This user is from outside of this forum
                                      mpatch@lemmy.world
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #41

                                      Corn is a garbage crop to grow at home. The height thing is kina dumb, because they probably wouldn’t bat an eye about sunflowers and roses up on a trellis. But corn basically robs all the nutrients in the gardens soil incredibly fast, starving the other crops. Also as produce corn is the cheapest and most abundant staple and to grow a some what substantial amount you gota give up a significant portion of your garden.

                                      L 1 Reply Last reply
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                                      • M mpatch@lemmy.world

                                        Corn is a garbage crop to grow at home. The height thing is kina dumb, because they probably wouldn’t bat an eye about sunflowers and roses up on a trellis. But corn basically robs all the nutrients in the gardens soil incredibly fast, starving the other crops. Also as produce corn is the cheapest and most abundant staple and to grow a some what substantial amount you gota give up a significant portion of your garden.

                                        L This user is from outside of this forum
                                        L This user is from outside of this forum
                                        lyrl@lemmy.dbzer0.com
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #42

                                        There is a house a few blocks from me that, due to the shape of their property, has no backyard, it’s all front. They have maybe fifteen young chestnut trees (bloomed for the first time this spring, but don’t seem to have set), hazelnut bushes between all the trees, and maybe a ten foot by six foot bed of corn. I think other stuff, too, but those are the eye catching things.

                                        I have no idea what they think they are going to do with all those nuts once the trees and bushes start producing, or whether they are growing some interesting variety of corn or just find it entertaining to grow a supermarket variety themselves, but it’s their property and I feel like they should be able to do what they want (garbage crops included) without the city getting up in their business.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • Binzy_BoiB Binzy_Boi

                                          I think the term is fine if you approach it from an “invasive species” mindset rather than an “undesirable” mindset.

                                          I don’t know if it was intentionally done by my teachers, but that’s the impression I always got about the term since it was usually brought up in the context of introduced species of plants causing harm to native species. Stuff like dandelions and such.

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                                          deathsembrace@lemmy.world
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #43

                                          This is the real problem. Where the fuck did you find a plant only native in South America?

                                          1 Reply Last reply
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