Skip to content
0
  • Home
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • World
  • Users
  • Groups
  • Home
  • Recent
  • Tags
  • Popular
  • World
  • Users
  • Groups
Skins
  • Light
  • Brite
  • Cerulean
  • Cosmo
  • Flatly
  • Journal
  • Litera
  • Lumen
  • Lux
  • Materia
  • Minty
  • Morph
  • Pulse
  • Sandstone
  • Simplex
  • Sketchy
  • Spacelab
  • United
  • Yeti
  • Zephyr
  • Dark
  • Cyborg
  • Darkly
  • Quartz
  • Slate
  • Solar
  • Superhero
  • Vapor

  • Default (Sketchy)
  • No Skin
Collapse

Wandering Adventure Party

  1. Home
  2. Canada
  3. From ‘Elbows Up’ to Capitulation and Back | The Tyee

From ‘Elbows Up’ to Capitulation and Back | The Tyee

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Canada
canada
41 Posts 19 Posters 97 Views
  • Oldest to Newest
  • Newest to Oldest
  • Most Votes
Reply
  • Reply as topic
Log in to reply
This topic has been deleted. Only users with topic management privileges can see it.
  • breakfastmtnB This user is from outside of this forum
    breakfastmtnB This user is from outside of this forum
    breakfastmtn
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    It was a moment of global clarity. Prime Minister Mark Carney’s speech to the world’s political and economic elite gathered in Davos this week described global realities, past and present, with a candour and nuance rarely heard from a serving politician.

    The message was twofold.

    First, Carney made clear that the world has changed, and the old comfortable ways of global politics are not coming back. Those who wait for sanity to return are waiting in vain. We are in a world increasingly shaped by the threat and the use of hard power. All states must accept that reality.

    Despite this, Carney’s second and more hopeful message was that while the globally powerful may act unilaterally, others — notably “middle powers” like Canada — are not helpless.

    By finding ways to co-operate on areas of shared interest, states like Canada can pool their limited resources to build what amounts to a flexible network of co-operative ties. Taken together they can provide an alternative to simply rolling over and taking whatever great powers like the United States dole out.

    freebooter69@lemmy.caF Z M 7 G 5 Replies Last reply
    120
    • breakfastmtnB breakfastmtn

      It was a moment of global clarity. Prime Minister Mark Carney’s speech to the world’s political and economic elite gathered in Davos this week described global realities, past and present, with a candour and nuance rarely heard from a serving politician.

      The message was twofold.

      First, Carney made clear that the world has changed, and the old comfortable ways of global politics are not coming back. Those who wait for sanity to return are waiting in vain. We are in a world increasingly shaped by the threat and the use of hard power. All states must accept that reality.

      Despite this, Carney’s second and more hopeful message was that while the globally powerful may act unilaterally, others — notably “middle powers” like Canada — are not helpless.

      By finding ways to co-operate on areas of shared interest, states like Canada can pool their limited resources to build what amounts to a flexible network of co-operative ties. Taken together they can provide an alternative to simply rolling over and taking whatever great powers like the United States dole out.

      freebooter69@lemmy.caF This user is from outside of this forum
      freebooter69@lemmy.caF This user is from outside of this forum
      freebooter69@lemmy.ca
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      I feel this is a pivotal moment in history. If we can somehow avoid an American invasion, we can help build a more just and equitable world, one that can stand in front of giants and say, nuh uh with a waggy finger!

      A S 2 Replies Last reply
      34
      • freebooter69@lemmy.caF freebooter69@lemmy.ca

        I feel this is a pivotal moment in history. If we can somehow avoid an American invasion, we can help build a more just and equitable world, one that can stand in front of giants and say, nuh uh with a waggy finger!

        A This user is from outside of this forum
        A This user is from outside of this forum
        armchairace1944@lemmy.ca
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Given that Carney will allow corporations to rule Canada with an iron fist it will only be a different kind of tyranny. Between a rock and a hard place and all that.

        God. I hate living in this timeline.

        freebooter69@lemmy.caF 1 Reply Last reply
        22
        • freebooter69@lemmy.caF freebooter69@lemmy.ca

          I feel this is a pivotal moment in history. If we can somehow avoid an American invasion, we can help build a more just and equitable world, one that can stand in front of giants and say, nuh uh with a waggy finger!

          S This user is from outside of this forum
          S This user is from outside of this forum
          sbv@sh.itjust.works
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          The key part comes from what Carney said about living in the lie: we can’t just give lip service to those principles, like we did before.

          I honestly have no idea what that would look like. Should we have put boots on the ground in Ukraine? What about the CCP’s oppression of Uyghurs? Okay, now climate change?

          Maybe the answer is that we be less principled, but honest about where we’re willing to act.

          Avid AmoebaA 1 Reply Last reply
          26
          • A armchairace1944@lemmy.ca

            Given that Carney will allow corporations to rule Canada with an iron fist it will only be a different kind of tyranny. Between a rock and a hard place and all that.

            God. I hate living in this timeline.

            freebooter69@lemmy.caF This user is from outside of this forum
            freebooter69@lemmy.caF This user is from outside of this forum
            freebooter69@lemmy.ca
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            I think we aren’t as powerless as you think and that we have both done something that seems small but is a step in the direction of freedom from those corporations. We have joined a platform not owned by them. We have freedom to choose and make our thoughts heard still. So elbows up into the jaw of cynicism.

            Avid AmoebaA T A 3 Replies Last reply
            17
            • breakfastmtnB breakfastmtn

              It was a moment of global clarity. Prime Minister Mark Carney’s speech to the world’s political and economic elite gathered in Davos this week described global realities, past and present, with a candour and nuance rarely heard from a serving politician.

              The message was twofold.

              First, Carney made clear that the world has changed, and the old comfortable ways of global politics are not coming back. Those who wait for sanity to return are waiting in vain. We are in a world increasingly shaped by the threat and the use of hard power. All states must accept that reality.

              Despite this, Carney’s second and more hopeful message was that while the globally powerful may act unilaterally, others — notably “middle powers” like Canada — are not helpless.

              By finding ways to co-operate on areas of shared interest, states like Canada can pool their limited resources to build what amounts to a flexible network of co-operative ties. Taken together they can provide an alternative to simply rolling over and taking whatever great powers like the United States dole out.

              Z This user is from outside of this forum
              Z This user is from outside of this forum
              ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              I moved from Lebanon 8 years ago with my Canadian wife, and I was happy to leave that unstable region with the worst neighbours. Alas, I’m fated to live next to terrible neighbours again. I hope Canada will strengthen the relations with the rest of the world, and never turn to the US again. And as an anti-capitalist and anti-facist, I hope Canada does not become like the US.

              I Avid AmoebaA D G 4 Replies Last reply
              44
              • Z ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca

                I moved from Lebanon 8 years ago with my Canadian wife, and I was happy to leave that unstable region with the worst neighbours. Alas, I’m fated to live next to terrible neighbours again. I hope Canada will strengthen the relations with the rest of the world, and never turn to the US again. And as an anti-capitalist and anti-facist, I hope Canada does not become like the US.

                I This user is from outside of this forum
                I This user is from outside of this forum
                iamthetot
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Ah, so you brought it with you!

                /s

                Z 1 Reply Last reply
                15
                • S sbv@sh.itjust.works

                  The key part comes from what Carney said about living in the lie: we can’t just give lip service to those principles, like we did before.

                  I honestly have no idea what that would look like. Should we have put boots on the ground in Ukraine? What about the CCP’s oppression of Uyghurs? Okay, now climate change?

                  Maybe the answer is that we be less principled, but honest about where we’re willing to act.

                  Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                  Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                  Avid Amoeba
                  wrote on last edited by avidamoeba@lemmy.ca
                  #8

                  Maybe the answer is that we be less principled, but honest about where we’re willing to act.

                  This. He said that in unambiguous terms that being able to act on principle is a right won on the back of having eliminated your vulnerability to coercion.

                  That means a country that wants to act in principled manner must be able to produce what it needs to survive and defend itself. Otherwise demanding country X do Y when you depend on X for your survival is just propaganda theatre produced for whoever it placates. We’re very far from that, so we’re likely dropping the theatre.

                  S 1 Reply Last reply
                  14
                  • freebooter69@lemmy.caF freebooter69@lemmy.ca

                    I think we aren’t as powerless as you think and that we have both done something that seems small but is a step in the direction of freedom from those corporations. We have joined a platform not owned by them. We have freedom to choose and make our thoughts heard still. So elbows up into the jaw of cynicism.

                    Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                    Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                    Avid Amoeba
                    wrote on last edited by avidamoeba@lemmy.ca
                    #9

                    Us here, yes. That said parent’s talking about what Carney might do to achieve the vision of regaining sovereignty and that’s one likely future given similar historical conditions. If that’s where it goes, we’d have to do a lot more to resist getting crushed by the corporate machine than we’re doing today. There’s historical templates for that too so there’s reason for optimism. E.g. radical unionism.

                    I share your optimism though. I also think that barring invasion, we’ll be alright and possibly have decent future. At least until climate change destabilizes the world. 😄

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    4
                    • Z ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca

                      I moved from Lebanon 8 years ago with my Canadian wife, and I was happy to leave that unstable region with the worst neighbours. Alas, I’m fated to live next to terrible neighbours again. I hope Canada will strengthen the relations with the rest of the world, and never turn to the US again. And as an anti-capitalist and anti-facist, I hope Canada does not become like the US.

                      Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                      Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                      Avid Amoeba
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      In some ways, you lived next to the US then, and you live next to the US now. 😄

                      Z 1 Reply Last reply
                      10
                      • freebooter69@lemmy.caF freebooter69@lemmy.ca

                        I think we aren’t as powerless as you think and that we have both done something that seems small but is a step in the direction of freedom from those corporations. We have joined a platform not owned by them. We have freedom to choose and make our thoughts heard still. So elbows up into the jaw of cynicism.

                        T This user is from outside of this forum
                        T This user is from outside of this forum
                        typhoon@lemmy.ca
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        but is a step in the direction of freedom from those corporations.

                        The Liberal party introduced Bill C-15 which literally allows any corporation to be exempted from any law.

                        Link Preview Image
                        Bill C-15 would allow corporations to be exempt from most Canadian laws | CCPA - Lemmy.ca

                        Lemmy

                        favicon

                        (lemmy.ca)

                        They know who they want to rule us.

                        D 1 Reply Last reply
                        8
                        • Avid AmoebaA Avid Amoeba

                          In some ways, you lived next to the US then, and you live next to the US now. 😄

                          Z This user is from outside of this forum
                          Z This user is from outside of this forum
                          ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #12

                          True. There’s no escape from those fuckers.

                          afallinganvil@lemmy.caA 1 Reply Last reply
                          7
                          • I iamthetot

                            Ah, so you brought it with you!

                            /s

                            Z This user is from outside of this forum
                            Z This user is from outside of this forum
                            ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #13

                            Heheh sorry guys i jinxed everyone.

                            1 Reply Last reply
                            9
                            • Z ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca

                              I moved from Lebanon 8 years ago with my Canadian wife, and I was happy to leave that unstable region with the worst neighbours. Alas, I’m fated to live next to terrible neighbours again. I hope Canada will strengthen the relations with the rest of the world, and never turn to the US again. And as an anti-capitalist and anti-facist, I hope Canada does not become like the US.

                              D This user is from outside of this forum
                              D This user is from outside of this forum
                              discomatic
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #14

                              Every Lebanese person I’ve ever met has been rad AF. Please explain.

                              Z 1 Reply Last reply
                              4
                              • Avid AmoebaA Avid Amoeba

                                Maybe the answer is that we be less principled, but honest about where we’re willing to act.

                                This. He said that in unambiguous terms that being able to act on principle is a right won on the back of having eliminated your vulnerability to coercion.

                                That means a country that wants to act in principled manner must be able to produce what it needs to survive and defend itself. Otherwise demanding country X do Y when you depend on X for your survival is just propaganda theatre produced for whoever it placates. We’re very far from that, so we’re likely dropping the theatre.

                                S This user is from outside of this forum
                                S This user is from outside of this forum
                                sbv@sh.itjust.works
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #15

                                In theory we have a principled stance on Ukraine, Gaza, Afghanistan, and whatever is going down in Myanmar. We don’t depend on those countries, but I would be very surprised if we change our verbiage or actions toward those countries.

                                Avid AmoebaA 1 Reply Last reply
                                3
                                • D discomatic

                                  Every Lebanese person I’ve ever met has been rad AF. Please explain.

                                  Z This user is from outside of this forum
                                  Z This user is from outside of this forum
                                  ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #16

                                  Explain what exactly?

                                  afallinganvil@lemmy.caA D 2 Replies Last reply
                                  3
                                  • breakfastmtnB breakfastmtn

                                    It was a moment of global clarity. Prime Minister Mark Carney’s speech to the world’s political and economic elite gathered in Davos this week described global realities, past and present, with a candour and nuance rarely heard from a serving politician.

                                    The message was twofold.

                                    First, Carney made clear that the world has changed, and the old comfortable ways of global politics are not coming back. Those who wait for sanity to return are waiting in vain. We are in a world increasingly shaped by the threat and the use of hard power. All states must accept that reality.

                                    Despite this, Carney’s second and more hopeful message was that while the globally powerful may act unilaterally, others — notably “middle powers” like Canada — are not helpless.

                                    By finding ways to co-operate on areas of shared interest, states like Canada can pool their limited resources to build what amounts to a flexible network of co-operative ties. Taken together they can provide an alternative to simply rolling over and taking whatever great powers like the United States dole out.

                                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                                    mongostein@lemmy.ca
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #17

                                    Do people not get that he needs to play nice with Trump? Like what do you want him to say to the guy? “Go fuck yourself!”?

                                    Maybe if we had a similarly sized military….

                                    F R 2 Replies Last reply
                                    16
                                    • S sbv@sh.itjust.works

                                      In theory we have a principled stance on Ukraine, Gaza, Afghanistan, and whatever is going down in Myanmar. We don’t depend on those countries, but I would be very surprised if we change our verbiage or actions toward those countries.

                                      Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Avid AmoebaA This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Avid Amoeba
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #18

                                      I think it’s gonna be case by case basis depending on the expected blowback.

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      2
                                      • Z ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca

                                        Explain what exactly?

                                        afallinganvil@lemmy.caA This user is from outside of this forum
                                        afallinganvil@lemmy.caA This user is from outside of this forum
                                        afallinganvil@lemmy.ca
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #19

                                        Why you’re all rad, I presume

                                        Z 1 Reply Last reply
                                        9
                                        • Z ziggythezygote@lemmy.ca

                                          True. There’s no escape from those fuckers.

                                          afallinganvil@lemmy.caA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          afallinganvil@lemmy.caA This user is from outside of this forum
                                          afallinganvil@lemmy.ca
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #20

                                          The sun never sets on the shithead empire

                                          1 Reply Last reply
                                          5

                                          Hello! It looks like you're interested in this conversation, but you don't have an account yet.

                                          Getting fed up of having to scroll through the same posts each visit? When you register for an account, you'll always come back to exactly where you were before, and choose to be notified of new replies (either via email, or push notification). You'll also be able to save bookmarks and upvote posts to show your appreciation to other community members.

                                          With your input, this post could be even better 💗

                                          Register Login
                                          Reply
                                          • Reply as topic
                                          Log in to reply
                                          • Oldest to Newest
                                          • Newest to Oldest
                                          • Most Votes


                                          • Login

                                          • Login or register to search.
                                          Powered by NodeBB Contributors
                                          • First post
                                            Last post