Prime Minister Mark Carney is under intense pressure from the United States and Car Companies to make an electric vehicle U-turn.
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But there are some things about EVs that cannot be overcome because science. Like the fact that gasoline holds far more energy for its weight than batteries ever can. Which is why things like the Tesla semi is a flop. Because to get the range you get out of two saddle tanks of diesel the semi would have to carry much more weight in batteries than is practical and charge times and kW input would be astronomical.
The same goes for cars but to a lesser extent. We CAN make them go far (a Lucid EV just set a record at 1205 km on a single charge) but that car costs well over 150,000 because of the massive amount of batteries needed.
Then there’s the electrical infrastructure issue. Most EV owners charge at home, but if EVERY household had an EV there will be a significant new draw on our electrical grid. If everyone charges at night thats not a huge deal but obviously if everyone had an EV there going to be a lot of people charging during the day too, especially on trips. We’d have to add a lot of power to our grid and EVERY power source requires some kind of environmental cost, the question is only how much.
But there are some things about EVs that cannot be overcome because science. Like the fact that gasoline holds far more energy for its weight than batteries ever can.
That’s true for our current batteries. Where does science say we’ll never be able to make batteries with a higher energy density than fossil fuels?
This is merely one of the limitations I mentioned manufacturers need to work on.
We’d have to add a lot of power to our grid and EVERY power source requires some kind of environmental cost, the question is only how much.
Right, which is why we need to build out renewable capacity as we go. By forcing EVs onto the market it would spur home owners to add solar panels to their roofs. The rise in demand would increase new production. Again, that’s why it’s a long term phase out rather than cutting over suddenly.
Also it’s far more efficient to generate power in large facilities rather than in lots of little ones. It’s better to have a few larger power generation plants rather than every car having its own. It’s the economy of scale. One generator that produces enough power for 100 vehicles is more efficient than 100 generators powering one vehicle each. Transmission distance lowers that efficiency, so hopefully those sources can be clean and local to where they’re being used.
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According to Politico, Mark Carney is under intense pressure.
Auto Manufacturers want to get rid of the electric vehicle mandate. They simply refuse to sell more small electric cars in Canada, claiming it’s impossible / unprofitable.
They also say Donald Trump is now President of the United States. Climate Change is no longer an american concern. The political climate in the United States has changed and Canada should follow the US, whether it likes or not.
https://www.politico.com/news/2025/07/10/canada-ev-mandate-elon-musk-tesla-00446980
Fuck Carney if he caves 1 milimetre on this fascist bullshit.
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EVs are a halfway solution anyway. We need to be investing in mass transit. If every car turned into an EV, we would still have politicians like Doug Ford trying to tunnel under a highway to end gridlock, we would still have motorists claiming bikes cause congestion, we would still be creating tonnes of tire waste and microplastics pollution, people will continue to die on roads while accidents could get worse due to extra weight, and our roads will wear down faster and cost more to maintain due to the extra weight.
In the grand scheme of things, EVs solve almost none of the major problems presented by cars.
Mass transit is great for cities and that’s it right now. If you live in an area with less than 500,000 people mass transit isn’t happening for awhile. EVs give us clean powered vehicles for the interim which - optimistically - will still be 20-30 years.
Stopping EVs now is a bad idea. Use them to leverage electric renewable infrastucture.
For cities, though, yeah minimal cars is better.
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But there are some things about EVs that cannot be overcome because science. Like the fact that gasoline holds far more energy for its weight than batteries ever can.
That’s true for our current batteries. Where does science say we’ll never be able to make batteries with a higher energy density than fossil fuels?
This is merely one of the limitations I mentioned manufacturers need to work on.
We’d have to add a lot of power to our grid and EVERY power source requires some kind of environmental cost, the question is only how much.
Right, which is why we need to build out renewable capacity as we go. By forcing EVs onto the market it would spur home owners to add solar panels to their roofs. The rise in demand would increase new production. Again, that’s why it’s a long term phase out rather than cutting over suddenly.
Also it’s far more efficient to generate power in large facilities rather than in lots of little ones. It’s better to have a few larger power generation plants rather than every car having its own. It’s the economy of scale. One generator that produces enough power for 100 vehicles is more efficient than 100 generators powering one vehicle each. Transmission distance lowers that efficiency, so hopefully those sources can be clean and local to where they’re being used.
Where does science say we’ll never be able to make batteries with a higher energy density than fossil fuels?
Well nowhere except that the mandate is trying to force the changeover in five years time, and despite multiple announcements about ‘new’ ‘long range’ batteries, no ones been able to make the quantum leap needed. And its not a minor gap: Gasoline stores about 47.5 MJ/kg, while lithium-ion batteries typically store around 0.3 MJ/kg. This means gasoline provides roughly 100 times more energy per unit of weight. Thats a huge leap for batteries to overcome.
Also, EVs are competing against gas cars but gas cars are also improving a great deal. It used to be getting 25 mpg in a sedan was impressive enough, but I just talked to an owner with a Maverick hybrid who said on her best run she got almost 70 mpg. Incredible for a small truck.
Hybrids may be the answer. Full battery EVs dont do everything and gas cars have issues, but hybrids bridge the gap. The main problem there being that now you have to maintain two drive systems, so its not exactly a recipe for easy maintenance as they age.
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Mass transit is great for cities and that’s it right now. If you live in an area with less than 500,000 people mass transit isn’t happening for awhile. EVs give us clean powered vehicles for the interim which - optimistically - will still be 20-30 years.
Stopping EVs now is a bad idea. Use them to leverage electric renewable infrastucture.
For cities, though, yeah minimal cars is better.
Somewhere with 500,000 people can definitely make use of transit. Maybe not mass but definitely trams, buses and regional rail. Also active infrastructure like bike lanes (granted provinces seem to be at war with cyclists recently).
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They’re not wrong.
Ive owned an EV for 7 years now and it does some things really well and its not very good at others. Its not SUPERIOR to my gas vehicles, its just different.
Its ludicrous to tell Canadians that they can ONLY buy EVs at a certain point. It doesnt make sense to force that change when they dont suit a lot of applications. For example there are currently NO EVs that are great at pulling trailers, they lose far too much range when hauling. They also lose 20 to 40% of their range in winter. They also take considerably longer to charge on a road trip than a gas car takes to fill up and thats only IF you can find a convenient charger, its available, its working and you have signed up for the correct payment app - not nearly as simple as using a gas station.
They ARE good for commuting especially if you live in a city. And theres no denying that they are far less costly to maintain. My little EV has cost a TOTAL of $400 in 7 years. Thats amazingly low. And its very reliable. Nothing to check, just unplug it and drive it. But its still not my first choice for many tasks.
Buyers aren’t stupid, they will buy what they need and what suits their lifestyle, not what the gov tells them they need.
It doesnt make sense to force that change when they dont suit a lot of applications.
So when the worlds climate scientists say we must stop buring fossil fuels or risk the collpase of civilisation, your retort is, only when it’s convenient for Candaians ?
When it’s pointed out that many millions around the world die every year from transport pollution, sucks to be them?
Here’s what one Canadian had to say to that
UN expert attacks ‘exploitative’ world economy in fight to save planet
Outgoing special rapporteur David Boyd says ‘there’s something wrong with our brains that we can’t understand how grave this is’
the Guardian (www.theguardian.com)
Outgoing special rapporteur David Boyd says ‘there’s something wrong with our brains that we can’t understand how grave this is’
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You bring good points! My concern about battery life is more specifically about the toll fast charging puts on a battery, and such a car would be supercharging for most of its existence.
I did rent out a dual motor long range IONIQ 5 for a test trip, I really enjoyed it, but I was stuck for an hour at a fast charger at a random closed Ford dealership off the side of the 20 on the way back because I couldn’t charge at my destination in Levis during the day.
I also had a LOT of issues with Electrify Canada and Flo, from non-functional stations to stations where the sessions just wouldn’t end. It happened twice, and the second time it happened, it took support (I forget which company, I think Flo) a whole WEEK to close the charging session properly. During that time, I could not open any other charge session, and had to call support every time I wanted to charge.
Otherwise, Quebec’s charging infrastructure is okay, but the lack of fast chargers (350kw+) make it difficult to do long trips without stopping constantly, and northern Ontario / Quebec is basically devoid of charging stations.
The toll that fast charging puts on the battery tends to mostly be a problem either in very hot climates, or in instances where you’re charging to 100% a lot. But if you’re using fast charging mostly to get up to 80% here in Canada you’re likely not going to run into a significant decrease in battery life.
(Unfortunately, we can’t say much about this from real world experience, as vehicles that can handle 350kW+ charging are still somewhat rare, and those that do exist (like vehicles built upon Hyundai’s E-GMP platform) aren’t even 5 years old yet).
I drive an AWD IONIQ 5 (Ultimate Edition FWIW) — and the most trouble I’ve had at chargers has simply been lining up when it’s been too busy, and having to wait for much slower charging vehicles to finish up at fast chargers. But that has also been rare, and is more common through the BC interior where there are long distances between towns/cities through the mountains and EVERYONE stops at them to top up. But I’ve certainly heard my share of stories. Indeed, just last week I was helping a friend who is taking a road trip out to Alberta find suitable charging near his hotel — and it turns out that in that area there has been a significant problem with people chopping off the cables repeatedly.
It’s only getting better — but where things are improving is pretty uneven. But this is where the EVSE installation credit for car manufacturers is so important — and why we can’t back down on the 2035 phase-out of sales of purely gasoline powered vehicles (recall, PHEVs are permitted for sale after 2035 by the current rules). If the automakers can’t make the 2026 sales targets they can start building out the EVSEs we need to convince people it’s safe to buy more EVs.
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The toll that fast charging puts on the battery tends to mostly be a problem either in very hot climates, or in instances where you’re charging to 100% a lot. But if you’re using fast charging mostly to get up to 80% here in Canada you’re likely not going to run into a significant decrease in battery life.
(Unfortunately, we can’t say much about this from real world experience, as vehicles that can handle 350kW+ charging are still somewhat rare, and those that do exist (like vehicles built upon Hyundai’s E-GMP platform) aren’t even 5 years old yet).
I drive an AWD IONIQ 5 (Ultimate Edition FWIW) — and the most trouble I’ve had at chargers has simply been lining up when it’s been too busy, and having to wait for much slower charging vehicles to finish up at fast chargers. But that has also been rare, and is more common through the BC interior where there are long distances between towns/cities through the mountains and EVERYONE stops at them to top up. But I’ve certainly heard my share of stories. Indeed, just last week I was helping a friend who is taking a road trip out to Alberta find suitable charging near his hotel — and it turns out that in that area there has been a significant problem with people chopping off the cables repeatedly.
It’s only getting better — but where things are improving is pretty uneven. But this is where the EVSE installation credit for car manufacturers is so important — and why we can’t back down on the 2035 phase-out of sales of purely gasoline powered vehicles (recall, PHEVs are permitted for sale after 2035 by the current rules). If the automakers can’t make the 2026 sales targets they can start building out the EVSEs we need to convince people it’s safe to buy more EVs.
I lived with the exact same car you have, and yeah, waiting for slow cars at fast chargers was one of the pain points, but I think this is just a question of social etiquette. More charging infrastructure should also resolve this issue.
You may very well be right about our temperatures generally not being high enough to hammer the battery that much, though Quebec summers can get pretty hot for short periods of time.
How is your IONIQ 5 in the deep of winter, with winter tires and -25c weather? I never drove such an EV in winter, and since current EVs rely so much on the insane efficiency of their motors rather than the battery capacity, temperature and tires can make a difference in range.
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It doesnt make sense to force that change when they dont suit a lot of applications.
So when the worlds climate scientists say we must stop buring fossil fuels or risk the collpase of civilisation, your retort is, only when it’s convenient for Candaians ?
When it’s pointed out that many millions around the world die every year from transport pollution, sucks to be them?
Here’s what one Canadian had to say to that
UN expert attacks ‘exploitative’ world economy in fight to save planet
Outgoing special rapporteur David Boyd says ‘there’s something wrong with our brains that we can’t understand how grave this is’
the Guardian (www.theguardian.com)
Outgoing special rapporteur David Boyd says ‘there’s something wrong with our brains that we can’t understand how grave this is’
The thing is the environment doesnt care WHERE the GHG’s are coming from. So it makes sense to attack the problem where the problem is. And the problem is NOT in Canada. Our emissions are a margin of error in the global scale and Canada does very well because we have such a huge land mass and a lot of plants and trees to take up our carbon and GHG’s.
So when people say we have to buy EVs, thats a pretty ridiculous statement for Canadians. If EVERY vehicle in Canada was an EV the global climate would not even notice the difference. Therefore forcing EVs in Canada is far more about performative actions and virtue signalling than it is about actually changing the environment.
What would actually make a difference is to change the way we do business with the two biggest polluters in the world - China and the USA. They are dumping GHGs into the atmosphere by the tonne. Its like a boat has hit a log that’s punched a huge hole in the hull and water is pouring in but Canada is here putting a bandaid over a little crack at the back of the boat. We just dont matter til the big hole is fixed and even if the little crack is completely sealed the boat is still sinking fast.
It wouldn’t be hard to say to both countries, we will limit our trade with you til you clean up your act. Put a limit on China’s emissions in order for us to buy their goods.
But that won’t happen. Because that eats into profits. And no corporation is going to support that. So instead they push Joe Average to buy an EV, as if parking his 20 yr old Corolla and buying an 60k EV is going to make a smidgen of difference in the worlds climate. It wont. But that doesnt matter, what matters is that no one looks too hard at whose doing the damage and forcing them to change because it will worsen their bottom line. The EV message is mostly smoke and mirrors to keep you from looking behind the curtain.
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I lived with the exact same car you have, and yeah, waiting for slow cars at fast chargers was one of the pain points, but I think this is just a question of social etiquette. More charging infrastructure should also resolve this issue.
You may very well be right about our temperatures generally not being high enough to hammer the battery that much, though Quebec summers can get pretty hot for short periods of time.
How is your IONIQ 5 in the deep of winter, with winter tires and -25c weather? I never drove such an EV in winter, and since current EVs rely so much on the insane efficiency of their motors rather than the battery capacity, temperature and tires can make a difference in range.
I live out on Vancouver Island these days (although have previously lived in Toronto and Montreal — so I know what summers there are like!), and we don’t get -25C weather. Snow is a bit of a rarity as well (we do tend to get snow a few times every winter — but it often doesn’t stick around or accumulate for long). As such, so far I haven’t even bothered to put winter tires on the car — I have M+S tire, the car is heavy, and “snow mode” (which you get by holding down the “Drive Mode” button on the steering wheel) does a great job of ensuring traction is maintained in the snow. For the maybe three times we get a bit of snow each year it more than suffices.
Fortunately I learned to drive in Southern Ontario with lake effect snowfall. It’s amazing how many people on the island just have no freaking clue how to deal with the tiniest dusting of snow
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