Let's talk #vampires.
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@juergen_hubert I'm excited. Imo, I wish there was more awareness of these sorts of vampire folklore vs the Hollywood kind.
Here is the next one:
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Here is the next one:
@juergen_hubert This is super interesting cause the relation to animals is still noted. It doesn't expressly say they are a shapeshifter, but the folktale does talk about how they are known by other animals. Does the original German imply that the animals fear them too?
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@juergen_hubert This is super interesting cause the relation to animals is still noted. It doesn't expressly say they are a shapeshifter, but the folktale does talk about how they are known by other animals. Does the original German imply that the animals fear them too?
No, it says that they are known _among_ animals - that is to say, that there are animal Nineslayers as well.
The previous tale mentioned a vampire who could change into different animal shapes. Though most commonly, animal shapeshifting in German folklore is the domain of (a) werewolves, (b) spirit projection, or (c) both.
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No, it says that they are known _among_ animals - that is to say, that there are animal Nineslayers as well.
The previous tale mentioned a vampire who could change into different animal shapes. Though most commonly, animal shapeshifting in German folklore is the domain of (a) werewolves, (b) spirit projection, or (c) both.
@juergen_hubert That is interesting. I like the concept of a vampire that is an animal first and foremost rather only being limited to humans.
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@mariam_al_masri_author @bookstodon
Those regions were very far from Ottoman influence.
From a German-language folklore perspective, the regions closest to the Ottoman Empire were the eastern regions of Austria, where there are quite a few folk tales of the Turkish invasions. But I haven't found any vampire tales yet (though I haven't read many collections from there, either).
… is there a paprika-vampire correlation then?
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… is there a paprika-vampire correlation then?
@clew @juergen_hubert Maybe Juergen can way more into it. I do know there is a relationship with herbs such as garlic, rowan, st. john's wort and wolfsbane for warding against vampires. There are various folklore books that talk about different herbs that belong to the devil, but I don't think vampires would have a strong historical connection because they were introduced from the Colombian Exchange so are probably more associated with Amerindian mythology.
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@clew @juergen_hubert Maybe Juergen can way more into it. I do know there is a relationship with herbs such as garlic, rowan, st. john's wort and wolfsbane for warding against vampires. There are various folklore books that talk about different herbs that belong to the devil, but I don't think vampires would have a strong historical connection because they were introduced from the Colombian Exchange so are probably more associated with Amerindian mythology.
I don't _think_ I have come across any mentions of herbs as vampire repellants in German folk tales, but I do have come across stories where they work as vampire repellants - here is an example:
Though I feel that we should be careful with assuming how widespread such beliefs were - too often, a certain claim pops up in some folklore encyclopedia, and this is then cited by everyone else and taken as gospel despite that claim not actually being all that common.
A good example is the notion that kobolds from German folklore were "mining spirits". This is everywhere in English-language discussions about German folklore because a 19th century English-language scholar claimed that this was the case, and everyone cited him and now kobolds in #dnd are miners as well.
But in actual German folklore, "kobold" was a generic term for "small, mischievous spirit" similar to the British "goblin" - they _might_ appear beneath the ground, but usually did not.
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I don't _think_ I have come across any mentions of herbs as vampire repellants in German folk tales, but I do have come across stories where they work as vampire repellants - here is an example:
Though I feel that we should be careful with assuming how widespread such beliefs were - too often, a certain claim pops up in some folklore encyclopedia, and this is then cited by everyone else and taken as gospel despite that claim not actually being all that common.
A good example is the notion that kobolds from German folklore were "mining spirits". This is everywhere in English-language discussions about German folklore because a 19th century English-language scholar claimed that this was the case, and everyone cited him and now kobolds in #dnd are miners as well.
But in actual German folklore, "kobold" was a generic term for "small, mischievous spirit" similar to the British "goblin" - they _might_ appear beneath the ground, but usually did not.
@juergen_hubert @clew This is a good point. The use of garlic appears in some folkloric encyclopedias but there's no sure way to see that it was like that in all regions.
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@juergen_hubert @clew This is a good point. The use of garlic appears in some folkloric encyclopedias but there's no sure way to see that it was like that in all regions.
And, of course, it could be propaganda spread by vampires to make their victims feel secure.
I am currently (very slowly) reading through an encyclopedia of creatures from Italian folklore + I wonder what this book has to say about garlic...
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And, of course, it could be propaganda spread by vampires to make their victims feel secure.
I am currently (very slowly) reading through an encyclopedia of creatures from Italian folklore + I wonder what this book has to say about garlic...
@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, I also like how wolfsbane was used for both vampires and werewolves and have to wonder if there's any studies about regional wards against vampires/undead.
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@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, I also like how wolfsbane was used for both vampires and werewolves and have to wonder if there's any studies about regional wards against vampires/undead.
Alas, that's beyond the current scope of my work. Though if I ever manage to do this full-time, I might delve into such superstitions - German folklorists collected lots of those too, though they are not as exciting to write and read about as folk tales.
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Alas, that's beyond the current scope of my work. Though if I ever manage to do this full-time, I might delve into such superstitions - German folklorists collected lots of those too, though they are not as exciting to write and read about as folk tales.
@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, folktales are much more fun and this is def a side research tangent.
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@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, folktales are much more fun and this is def a side research tangent.
Which isn't to say that such superstitions or customs aren't fascinating. Some customs are benign, or relatively harmless - like auctioning off dance partners for the next year, or throwing new husbands into a pond who had not sired a child within the first year of their marriage (they were allowed to designate _another_ man in the audience to be thrown into the pond after they emerged, to make it "fair").
Other customs were outright mobbing of people like "lazy" farm workers or women who had premarital sex. Either way, they present a fascinating view into the world of the mind in previous centuries.
But it's a niche topic within a niche topic, so it's better if I tackle it only after I have established myself as an author some more.
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@juergen_hubert That is interesting. I like the concept of a vampire that is an animal first and foremost rather only being limited to humans.
And here is the next one!
https://wiki.sunkencastles.com/wiki/The_Unh%C3%AEr_or_Unhuer
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And here is the next one!
https://wiki.sunkencastles.com/wiki/The_Unh%C3%AEr_or_Unhuer
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@juergen_hubert I'm wondering how many of these tales originated from medieval vampire mania. A lot of these kill vampire by desecrating graves seem to end in destroying the corpse by beheading, burning and stakes.
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Which isn't to say that such superstitions or customs aren't fascinating. Some customs are benign, or relatively harmless - like auctioning off dance partners for the next year, or throwing new husbands into a pond who had not sired a child within the first year of their marriage (they were allowed to designate _another_ man in the audience to be thrown into the pond after they emerged, to make it "fair").
Other customs were outright mobbing of people like "lazy" farm workers or women who had premarital sex. Either way, they present a fascinating view into the world of the mind in previous centuries.
But it's a niche topic within a niche topic, so it's better if I tackle it only after I have established myself as an author some more.
@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, and I do agree on that end. I think when it comes to being an author/translator, it is best to go for the topics that have appeal before you can really dive into some of these little tangent rabbit holes that research can get you into.
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@juergen_hubert @clew Yeah, and I do agree on that end. I think when it comes to being an author/translator, it is best to go for the topics that have appeal before you can really dive into some of these little tangent rabbit holes that research can get you into.
That's the plan!
Which is why I am first doing books on ghosts, the Devil, magic, and animal tales before doing a deep-dive into Ultraterrestrial Venetians.
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That's the plan!
Which is why I am first doing books on ghosts, the Devil, magic, and animal tales before doing a deep-dive into Ultraterrestrial Venetians.
@juergen_hubert @clew If you ever have any official publications, let me know. I'd love to read them and buy them by supporting the work that you do. I know the past couple days, talking with you about German vampire myths have helped me a lot as an author.
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@juergen_hubert I'm wondering how many of these tales originated from medieval vampire mania. A lot of these kill vampire by desecrating graves seem to end in destroying the corpse by beheading, burning and stakes.
Oh, many of these folk beliefs didn't die out for a long, long time. For instance, witch trials ended in the 18th century, but folk belief in witches lasted well into the 20th century in some regions.
And many of these vampire tales read like supernatural explanations for mundane infectious diseases and plagues.
