Our Tabletop group is considering what a post-Discord future would look like.
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Our Tabletop group is considering what a post-Discord future would look like.
There just aren’t a lot of good options. Most acceptable chat options are not free. Right now I cover the cost of hosting foundry, our wiki, and pay for pretty much everything else (books). If we spring for chat, that’s where I draw the line: I’d need to start charging dues and getting help hosting or paying. Obviously this is causing some consternation, and I know some members are financially struggling.
As much as I’d like to just keep providing for everyone equally, I’m becoming burnt out having my generosity taken for granted in every aspect of life. I wont throw out anyone who is in genuine need, but I need the other salaried adults in the room to squirm a bit. It’s kinda hard to keep a straight face when someone complains about paying for chat when I know they just bought 3 warhammer kits.
#TTRPG -
Our Tabletop group is considering what a post-Discord future would look like.
There just aren’t a lot of good options. Most acceptable chat options are not free. Right now I cover the cost of hosting foundry, our wiki, and pay for pretty much everything else (books). If we spring for chat, that’s where I draw the line: I’d need to start charging dues and getting help hosting or paying. Obviously this is causing some consternation, and I know some members are financially struggling.
As much as I’d like to just keep providing for everyone equally, I’m becoming burnt out having my generosity taken for granted in every aspect of life. I wont throw out anyone who is in genuine need, but I need the other salaried adults in the room to squirm a bit. It’s kinda hard to keep a straight face when someone complains about paying for chat when I know they just bought 3 warhammer kits.
#TTRPG@NullNowhere I think society at large would have to re-learn to pay for software instead of being the product.
That situation with warhammer to me shows that someone is not really thinking; thinking about the implications of their actions.
That being said, another way to approach it is to ask about how important our technological toys really are?
Your generosity is really the classic problem of the GM serving up their home, their time, their creativity and maybe even snacks. Share, friends?
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Our Tabletop group is considering what a post-Discord future would look like.
There just aren’t a lot of good options. Most acceptable chat options are not free. Right now I cover the cost of hosting foundry, our wiki, and pay for pretty much everything else (books). If we spring for chat, that’s where I draw the line: I’d need to start charging dues and getting help hosting or paying. Obviously this is causing some consternation, and I know some members are financially struggling.
As much as I’d like to just keep providing for everyone equally, I’m becoming burnt out having my generosity taken for granted in every aspect of life. I wont throw out anyone who is in genuine need, but I need the other salaried adults in the room to squirm a bit. It’s kinda hard to keep a straight face when someone complains about paying for chat when I know they just bought 3 warhammer kits.
#TTRPG@NullNowhere I have a suggestion, but it depends on a couple things:
You could just use IRC.
Setting up an IRC server is pretty straightforward these days, and they're light in terms of hardware requirements. Depending on how you're hosting foundry, you could even have the IRC server on the same device.
Obviously this doesn't account for the actual _time_ it takes to install and manage the software, which is not without value, but it would save you potentially hundreds of dollars a year on hosting fees.
I dunno how much of your post was soliciting options and how much of it was (very justified) venting, so I'll leave it at that. I will say that I greatly sympathize.
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@NullNowhere I have a suggestion, but it depends on a couple things:
You could just use IRC.
Setting up an IRC server is pretty straightforward these days, and they're light in terms of hardware requirements. Depending on how you're hosting foundry, you could even have the IRC server on the same device.
Obviously this doesn't account for the actual _time_ it takes to install and manage the software, which is not without value, but it would save you potentially hundreds of dollars a year on hosting fees.
I dunno how much of your post was soliciting options and how much of it was (very justified) venting, so I'll leave it at that. I will say that I greatly sympathize.
@b4ux1t3@hachyderm.io I’m always open for advice. IRC is on the table but voice is something we require. There is some thought about doing it through foundry but performance has historically been … well, dogshit. So we’ll see.
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@b4ux1t3@hachyderm.io I’m always open for advice. IRC is on the table but voice is something we require. There is some thought about doing it through foundry but performance has historically been … well, dogshit. So we’ll see.
@NullNowhere Adding voice isn't too hard with mumble. The big limiting factor is that it's just a lot to maintain as the group size increases, and folks are _used_ to doing things all in one app. Telling them "You need to download these two pieces of software to participate" when previously they had to have _zero_ extra pieces of software (since they already have a browser) could be a hard sell.
If you need to do it for a gaming group of, say, a couple dozen people, it's probably doable by one person. Source: I've done it, and I've set things up for folks who are _not_ computer literate to manage, too. The "maintenance" is really a form of light IT work; people will need help setting up the software on new computers as they get them, stuff like that. A solid PDF on how to set things up will work wonders here.
If you have a community that has a couple hundred people, my recommendation is definitely to pay for something, and it'll likely be web based, which is a plus, obviously.
I'd love to see foundry's builtin services get better, though. I think the problem historically has been that they've leaned on the fact that discord existed to not have to work on it, but I suspect they're going to need to address the quality pretty soon.
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@NullNowhere I think society at large would have to re-learn to pay for software instead of being the product.
That situation with warhammer to me shows that someone is not really thinking; thinking about the implications of their actions.
That being said, another way to approach it is to ask about how important our technological toys really are?
Your generosity is really the classic problem of the GM serving up their home, their time, their creativity and maybe even snacks. Share, friends?
@AndreasDavour@dice.camp Yep, people’s view of software value is entirely borked. They also accept this cycle of boom and bust that causes us to end up with nothing solid.
My own opinion is that we should host something open source. I’m tired of migrating services and wondering when the enshittification shoe is going to drop. I want honest to god infrastructure we can rely on, build on, and gain value from reliably.
All this boils down to people forgetting that nothing is free and that everything has an ecology that is happy to die if you just draw it down and/or neglect it. There is a responsibility in the notion of the commons -
@NullNowhere Adding voice isn't too hard with mumble. The big limiting factor is that it's just a lot to maintain as the group size increases, and folks are _used_ to doing things all in one app. Telling them "You need to download these two pieces of software to participate" when previously they had to have _zero_ extra pieces of software (since they already have a browser) could be a hard sell.
If you need to do it for a gaming group of, say, a couple dozen people, it's probably doable by one person. Source: I've done it, and I've set things up for folks who are _not_ computer literate to manage, too. The "maintenance" is really a form of light IT work; people will need help setting up the software on new computers as they get them, stuff like that. A solid PDF on how to set things up will work wonders here.
If you have a community that has a couple hundred people, my recommendation is definitely to pay for something, and it'll likely be web based, which is a plus, obviously.
I'd love to see foundry's builtin services get better, though. I think the problem historically has been that they've leaned on the fact that discord existed to not have to work on it, but I suspect they're going to need to address the quality pretty soon.
@b4ux1t3@hachyderm.io There is a bit you mention that makes me really not excited about this plan: The IT part.
I'm already the GM, the organizer, the primary bank and the sysadmin. And now ... the IT person. Because there ARE people who'd need that. I'm am aiming for less responsibility, not more. Maybe if someone else agrees to take up the post; but I'm kinda tapped out.
