When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
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@davidnjoku How many have received any training in good management practices? Much less actual, proper training?
@albertcardona I think you're on to something. In professions where people are promoted into management from jobs with more concrete outcomes (lines of code for developers or tables for carpenters) people tend to receive no training on how to be a manager and they have to work it out for themselves. Lord knows it took me years to figure it out, so maybe I should have some empathy for those a little behind me.
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When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku @purplepadma Sometimes it's literally a "cover your ass" move. By inviting everyone and their dog, you don't piss anyone off by giving them FOMO, *and* you dilute responsibility for any decisions that are taken. You remove the responsibility of following up with clear communication to anyone affected but not present, because you *invited* them.
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@albertcardona I think you're on to something. In professions where people are promoted into management from jobs with more concrete outcomes (lines of code for developers or tables for carpenters) people tend to receive no training on how to be a manager and they have to work it out for themselves. Lord knows it took me years to figure it out, so maybe I should have some empathy for those a little behind me.
Same in academia: from graduate student (largely working solo) to postdoctoral researcher (solo or directing sometimes one technician) to faculty member (recruiting and directing an entire research group. Amount of explicit or implicit training received: largely zero.
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When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku i always tried to keep them small, but discovered in large corporates that the easiest way to make progress was to ensure everyone was invited early on and then allow people to self-exclude or selectively attend afterwards. A good set of meeting minutes and an agenda helps.
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When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku Honestly corporate calendaring systems should show the organizer a 'projected cost' of the time for all the people they are inviting.
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Same in academia: from graduate student (largely working solo) to postdoctoral researcher (solo or directing sometimes one technician) to faculty member (recruiting and directing an entire research group. Amount of explicit or implicit training received: largely zero.
I got some management training as an academic. That I paid for myself (with my lab's money).
Now, things are slowly changing, and they noticed that training people actually helps the university save money so they are offering some basics. -
When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku @stufromoz it depends on the org; current client, there are many with the power to object but nobody wants to be the one to say “yes”. The only way to avoid future objections (“well I wasn’t in that meeting so I have to delay a week to research it”) that could derail a timeline is to get everyone in the same meeting and clearly give them that time to dissent: a real “speak now or forever hold your peace” thing. It’s not perfect but it solves for a lack of leadership and direction by providing it de facto in a situation where I don’t have role power.
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When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku I think it can be any of those or a combination, plus several more: no education on how to run a good meeting, a desire to CYA, a different lack of perspective (not thinking about how expensive an hour of all of those people’s salaries will be), etc.
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@davidnjoku I think it can be any of those or a combination, plus several more: no education on how to run a good meeting, a desire to CYA, a different lack of perspective (not thinking about how expensive an hour of all of those people’s salaries will be), etc.
@maxleibman I don't know if you remember but back in the day when Japan was this Eastern economical miracle, the West wanted to copy everything they did. One thing was these 15 min stand up meetings where people would actually be standing up. Now that I think about it, I guess the real lesson was that it forced meetings to be short with as few people as possible. Unsurprisingly we learned the wrong lessons and now have 1 hour "stand ups" with 30 people.
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@maxleibman I don't know if you remember but back in the day when Japan was this Eastern economical miracle, the West wanted to copy everything they did. One thing was these 15 min stand up meetings where people would actually be standing up. Now that I think about it, I guess the real lesson was that it forced meetings to be short with as few people as possible. Unsurprisingly we learned the wrong lessons and now have 1 hour "stand ups" with 30 people.
@davidnjoku I don’t recall firsthand but I’m familiar with the history (and ALL TOO familiar with the one-hour daily “stand-up” phenomenon).
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When organising meetings at work I try to keep the circle small, only inviting people who can actually contribute to the project.
Too many people go the other way and, seemingly, want to invite half the organisation to their irrelevant little meeting. Why is that?
@davidnjoku I think sometimes leaders want to invite folks who need to gain experience, so you end up with people who don't have the status or experience to contribute, but they get to learn how it's done. Other times i see the appropriate person invited as well as their leader, which tells me that their leader holds the reins tightly (maybe sometimes this is warranted, but usually it looks like micromanagement).
