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  3. On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

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  • Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau Vazh
    wrote last edited by
    #1

    On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg
    https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

    Moreau VazhT S. John RossS CharnockP Blind MapmakerB FoolishOwlF 7 Replies Last reply
    0
    • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

      On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg
      https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
      Moreau Vazh
      wrote last edited by
      #2

      Funnily enough, there seems to have been some long overdue discourse on this question in the last few days. For ages (primarily indie) designers have been trying to normalise the idea that it is somehow disrespectful to not run games as intended.

      Boo fucking hoo.

      I've known some of the people in my group for 20 years and I've been running games for over 30 years. I absolutely have a better handle on what is likely to work at my table than someone who hasn't even met me.

      Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

        On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg
        https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

        S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
        S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
        S. John Ross
        wrote last edited by
        #3

        @Taskerland As always, a nice read but, as always, your broad historical assertions seem like you might be pulling everyone's leg.

        Treating White Wolf (and Dragonlance, briefly) as a stand-in for "English-language" RPG history is approximately as sensible as making assertions about North American culinary trends based exclusively on several hundred visits to a Wendy's.

        Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

          Funnily enough, there seems to have been some long overdue discourse on this question in the last few days. For ages (primarily indie) designers have been trying to normalise the idea that it is somehow disrespectful to not run games as intended.

          Boo fucking hoo.

          I've known some of the people in my group for 20 years and I've been running games for over 30 years. I absolutely have a better handle on what is likely to work at my table than someone who hasn't even met me.

          Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
          Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
          Moreau Vazh
          wrote last edited by
          #4

          Obviously, if regular gamers get used to the idea that they can just reskin or kitbash rules they already own then they are less likely to spend money on another minute variation on games they already own, and where would the crowd-funding hashtags be if people decided they didn't need yet another D&D or PbtA variant?

          Play and mess with games you already own. Stop spending money on #ttrpg materials you won't play, don't read, and most likely won't even take out of their packaging.

          S. John RossS Roger BW 😷R CharnockP 3 Replies Last reply
          0
          • S. John RossS S. John Ross

            @Taskerland As always, a nice read but, as always, your broad historical assertions seem like you might be pulling everyone's leg.

            Treating White Wolf (and Dragonlance, briefly) as a stand-in for "English-language" RPG history is approximately as sensible as making assertions about North American culinary trends based exclusively on several hundred visits to a Wendy's.

            Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
            Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
            Moreau Vazh
            wrote last edited by
            #5

            @SJohnRoss So you don't think that there was a broad design trend from the mid-to-late 1980s onwards towards narrower and more regimented adventure design?

            Obviously I've completely failed to understand your complaints about low trust gaming.

            S. John RossS 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

              Obviously, if regular gamers get used to the idea that they can just reskin or kitbash rules they already own then they are less likely to spend money on another minute variation on games they already own, and where would the crowd-funding hashtags be if people decided they didn't need yet another D&D or PbtA variant?

              Play and mess with games you already own. Stop spending money on #ttrpg materials you won't play, don't read, and most likely won't even take out of their packaging.

              S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
              S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
              S. John Ross
              wrote last edited by
              #6

              @Taskerland Well now I'm trying to remember the most recent RPG thing I bought that had _packaging._ 😮

              I'm literally not sure.

              Maybe something in shrinkwrap in the early 2000s? 🤔

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                @SJohnRoss So you don't think that there was a broad design trend from the mid-to-late 1980s onwards towards narrower and more regimented adventure design?

                Obviously I've completely failed to understand your complaints about low trust gaming.

                S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                S. John Ross
                wrote last edited by
                #7

                @Taskerland I don't actually _have_ any complaints about low-trust gaming. But if I had any, I doubt they'd be less prone to misunderstanding than anything else I say on the matter. 😅

                And I think, of the dozens of adventure-design trends of the mid-to-late 1980s onwards, _some_ of them include narrower and more regimented designs for certain values of "regimented" and "narrower."

                But many, including the dominant trends of entire game lines, do not.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                  Obviously, if regular gamers get used to the idea that they can just reskin or kitbash rules they already own then they are less likely to spend money on another minute variation on games they already own, and where would the crowd-funding hashtags be if people decided they didn't need yet another D&D or PbtA variant?

                  Play and mess with games you already own. Stop spending money on #ttrpg materials you won't play, don't read, and most likely won't even take out of their packaging.

                  Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                  Roger BW 😷
                  wrote last edited by
                  #8

                  @Taskerland And quite possibly the game tailored with your group in mind may suit them better than anything off-the-peg.

                  Moreau VazhT S. John RossS 2 Replies Last reply
                  0
                  • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                    Obviously, if regular gamers get used to the idea that they can just reskin or kitbash rules they already own then they are less likely to spend money on another minute variation on games they already own, and where would the crowd-funding hashtags be if people decided they didn't need yet another D&D or PbtA variant?

                    Play and mess with games you already own. Stop spending money on #ttrpg materials you won't play, don't read, and most likely won't even take out of their packaging.

                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                    Charnock
                    wrote last edited by
                    #9

                    @Taskerland Leaving you bundles more money to spend on old paperstock on ebay to print props on.

                    I find it odd that there was ever a movement away from reskinning or kitbashing your own games. When we played in the 1980s that was de rigeur. It would have been unthinkable (outside of the btb D&D peeps) to play RPGs any other way.

                    Moreau VazhT Colman ReillyC 2 Replies Last reply
                    0
                    • Roger BW 😷R Roger BW 😷

                      @Taskerland And quite possibly the game tailored with your group in mind may suit them better than anything off-the-peg.

                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                      Moreau Vazh
                      wrote last edited by
                      #10

                      @RogerBW Exactly. Often for the simple reason that GM buy-in is a lot more consequential at the table than elegant design.

                      1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • Roger BW 😷R Roger BW 😷

                        @Taskerland And quite possibly the game tailored with your group in mind may suit them better than anything off-the-peg.

                        S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                        S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                        S. John Ross
                        wrote last edited by
                        #11

                        @RogerBW @Taskerland "Tailored" is an excellent choice of terms in this context.

                        "GM-as-tailor" is something I really value from the player side of things (when I'm fortunate to have a GM who includes that in their sack of roles).

                        Roger BW 😷R 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • S. John RossS S. John Ross

                          @RogerBW @Taskerland "Tailored" is an excellent choice of terms in this context.

                          "GM-as-tailor" is something I really value from the player side of things (when I'm fortunate to have a GM who includes that in their sack of roles).

                          Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                          Roger BW 😷R This user is from outside of this forum
                          Roger BW 😷
                          wrote last edited by
                          #12

                          @SJohnRoss @Taskerland I particularly use it to remind myself that I shouldn't expect to perform the whole process from bored sheep to well-dressed customer. I take cloth other people have made and adapt it to my purpose.

                          S. John RossS 1 Reply Last reply
                          0
                          • CharnockP Charnock

                            @Taskerland Leaving you bundles more money to spend on old paperstock on ebay to print props on.

                            I find it odd that there was ever a movement away from reskinning or kitbashing your own games. When we played in the 1980s that was de rigeur. It would have been unthinkable (outside of the btb D&D peeps) to play RPGs any other way.

                            Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                            Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                            Moreau Vazh
                            wrote last edited by
                            #13

                            @Printdevil I think it is a function of rpg social media being heavily parasocial and designers complaining.

                            They have even started using the term "casuals" to refer to people who aren't actively trying to monetise their hobbies.

                            Chef-Patron class consciousness in action.

                            CharnockP 2 Replies Last reply
                            0
                            • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                              On adapting Keep on the Borderlands and the case for never running games as written #ttrpg
                              https://tasker.land/2026/02/17/the-borderlands-unsettled/

                              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                              Charnock
                              wrote last edited by
                              #14

                              @Taskerland I think Keep on the Borderlands is narratively important in the development of gaming for many 80s players for all the reasons that you found voids in it. We found those, but the existence of npcs and their lives was quite compelling, so we filled in. It was for many people the first time we fleshed out a scenario to make it breath, to create the social ergs. Vectors of interaction. You can actually see it *should* be there but they had no language for it.

                              Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                                @Printdevil I think it is a function of rpg social media being heavily parasocial and designers complaining.

                                They have even started using the term "casuals" to refer to people who aren't actively trying to monetise their hobbies.

                                Chef-Patron class consciousness in action.

                                CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                Charnock
                                wrote last edited by
                                #15

                                @Taskerland That's just viewing people like us as itinerants on the commons that need "fenced away"

                                It's worse than chef and patrons I feel.

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • Roger BW 😷R Roger BW 😷

                                  @SJohnRoss @Taskerland I particularly use it to remind myself that I shouldn't expect to perform the whole process from bored sheep to well-dressed customer. I take cloth other people have made and adapt it to my purpose.

                                  S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                                  S. John RossS This user is from outside of this forum
                                  S. John Ross
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #16

                                  @RogerBW @Taskerland Yeah, I often do the same and it's a pretty joyful way to go about it. 😊

                                  Sometimes I do the sheep thing, too, but even then, I mix in some retailored works for variety.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                                    @Printdevil I think it is a function of rpg social media being heavily parasocial and designers complaining.

                                    They have even started using the term "casuals" to refer to people who aren't actively trying to monetise their hobbies.

                                    Chef-Patron class consciousness in action.

                                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    Charnock
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #17

                                    @Taskerland I still think a huge tension in monetising gaming is caused by it being easy to give tips on "how to make better ceilings for your mega dungeon" than "how to deal with Derek who takes his socks and shoes off during the game"

                                    The social contract of gaming is the important flex of it all, but also the hardest part to advise without sounding parental or patronising or both.

                                    Or a psycho.

                                    Which to be fair is probably my parental advice approach.

                                    Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • CharnockP Charnock

                                      @Taskerland I still think a huge tension in monetising gaming is caused by it being easy to give tips on "how to make better ceilings for your mega dungeon" than "how to deal with Derek who takes his socks and shoes off during the game"

                                      The social contract of gaming is the important flex of it all, but also the hardest part to advise without sounding parental or patronising or both.

                                      Or a psycho.

                                      Which to be fair is probably my parental advice approach.

                                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Moreau Vazh
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #18

                                      @Printdevil I used to play with a guy who used to wander around without shoes or socks and he'd often ask to borrow a pencil and then spend the entire game rubbing it between his toes.

                                      CharnockP Kera VortiwifeV 2 Replies Last reply
                                      0
                                      • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

                                        @Printdevil I used to play with a guy who used to wander around without shoes or socks and he'd often ask to borrow a pencil and then spend the entire game rubbing it between his toes.

                                        CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        Charnock
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #19

                                        @Taskerland See, very little of that in the youtube advice cycle.

                                        Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • CharnockP Charnock

                                          @Taskerland See, very little of that in the youtube advice cycle.

                                          Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                                          Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                                          Moreau Vazh
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #20

                                          @Printdevil That guy became a weird anti-fetish object for my best friend at the time. He used to just use the idea of what he might do to wind himself up.

                                          He'd sit in silence, looking like a bulldog chewing on a wasp and I'd ask what was wrong and he'd say he was angry because he had imagined said weirdo sending him a photograph of his penis.

                                          CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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