Valve Responds To Steam Machine's HDMI 2.1 Display Support Controversy [HW support is there, but "The HDMI forum" doesn’t allow with OpenSource drivers]
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See how well that has worked over the past 40 years? I mean don’t buy shit you don’t support obviously but don’t expect a personal boycott or even advocating heavily for others to the same to have any kind of impact whatsoever.
It’s because the average consumer is dumb but this isn’t an indictment of the average consumer, necessarily. The average consumer doesn’t want to have to do research on every fucking thing they buy to find out the nefarious bullshit about it. Oh the tv doesn’t support open connection standards, oh my phone is a walled garden built for data collection, oh this smart lightbulb is a privacy nightmare with bullshit tos and also has security issues, etc. They just want to go on amazon or to home depot or whatever and buy shit that looks like it will do what they need for a price point they can afford.
That’s where regulatory oversight comes in: given the above and a consistent lack of consumer ability to enforce standards we need political oversight to pick up the slack. This is a unified arm where a consumer frustration can turn into action much more quickly, even if sales continue because of market fuckery (eg tvs still selling because you can only buy hdmi TVs). But unfortunately we live in a country where the tech industry has performed a near and total regulatory capture and has no fear that regulatory oversight will ever occur, and they’re probably right, at least for now.
So you’re wrong that it’s the only way, and I would argue it’s the most ineffective and inefficient way. It just feels like it’s the only way because of our failed state political situation where even a regulatory concern that should be a slam dunk like right to repair often either fails or only passes in a greatly neutered state because the local politicians thought Microsoft and Apple made some great points about preventing local jobs so that tech billionaires could continue to make even more money
See how well that has worked over the past 40 years?
…extremely well? Can you provide an example of the contrary?
don’t expect a personal boycott or even advocating heavily for others to the same to have any kind of impact whatsoever.
…of course a single person boycotting a product does nothing. People educating themselves about the products they buy and making conscious decisions to buy consumer-friendly products when buying shit (especially expensive shit) does.
They just want to go on amazon or to home depot or whatever and buy shit that looks like it will do what they need for a price point they can afford.
Plenty of people know and just don’t care. I know because I have these types of conversations all the time.
That’s where regulatory oversight comes in
See how well that has worked over the past 2000 years?
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I’m not sure where I got this idea, but I thought it was because Display Port doesn’t carry audio, and a single-cable solution was more appealing.
But apparently Display Port also supports audio, just none of my devices seem to recognize it…?
Apparently the only advantage of HDMI is ARC (Audio Return Channel), allowing devices to send audio back to the video source, which might be useful in some home theater setups.
Ohh TIL, thanks! I could count the times I needed the TV to send audio back to the home theater, like if I want to watch open channels or something.
I think we could live without it, just plug an audio cable or something, fuck hdmi.
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Funny, I have done it for years at home, I guess I am just confused
Somebody replied to other comment, but it seems like hdmi allows audio to be sent back, like, if you wanted your screen to send audio to the computer… which would be weird in most PC scenarios, but not so much on TVs.
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I haveb’t looked into this particular group, but usually it’s patents. Someone owns a patent for the tech required to implement the standard, and they “license” it out to anyone who wants to implement that standard. Obviously, they won’t agree to terms that hurt their ability to collect rent on their patent. Qualcomm is famously guilty of this in the modem space.
Does that seem stupid, to adopt an industry standard that requires patented technology to implement? That’s because it is, and were we a sane society we would invalidate any patents that become an industry standard, but we’re a bunch of idiots with a billionaire cuck fetish.
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I’m not sure where I got this idea, but I thought it was because Display Port doesn’t carry audio, and a single-cable solution was more appealing.
But apparently Display Port also supports audio, just none of my devices seem to recognize it…?
Apparently the only advantage of HDMI is ARC (Audio Return Channel), allowing devices to send audio back to the video source, which might be useful in some home theater setups.
Wow I always assumed the same thing lol
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I remember when HDMI came out and then DP.
I wish I knew what was actually going on at the time with regards to licensing, I just knew they both worked and didn’t really pay much attention to things. Sometimes I’d use DP sometimes HDMI.
If I’d known, I definitely would have made a more concerted effort to support DP when it could have made a bigger difference.
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HDMI requires a license cost, DisplayPort is free.
What advantage does HDMI hold over DisplayPort?
My understanding is it’s not even a licensing issue. The HDMI consortium won’t let you include features from 2.1 and 2.2 in an open source driver. it sounds like Valve would be willing to pay, but they’d have to include a closed source driver for the video card.
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HDMI requires a license cost, DisplayPort is free.
What advantage does HDMI hold over DisplayPort?
HDMI has always sucked. I used DVI for the longest time, because HDMI couldn’t push enough pixels to a 1920x1200 display (topped out at 1080p for the longest time). Then jumped straight to display port when I finally got a 4k monitor.
HDMI was always 4-5 years behind other contemporary protocols, and for your trouble, you also got a stack of proprietary bullshit to go with it.
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The HDMI founders were Hitachi, Matsushita (now Panasonic), Maxell, Philips, Silicon Image (now Lattice Semiconductor), Sony, Thomson (now Vantiva), and Toshiba.[3] Intel contributed the HDCP copy protection system.[4] The new format won the support of motion picture studios Fox, Universal, Warner Bros. and Disney, along with content distributors DirecTV, EchoStar (Dish Network) and CableLabs.[2]
While Sony is a technology company, they’re also a very sue happy IP holder through Sony pictures and Playstation.
Sony continues to be a major player on the HDMI forum.
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the whole “vote with your wallet” thing is stupid anyway
Voting with your wallet is literally the only way things will ever improve.
Quit posting ancap propaganda.
The way this sort of thing would actually improve is by government regulation.
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You should literally never use the apps built in to your TV. Unless you just really like letting the TV manufacturer know exactly what you are watching and when.
On Linux you check the box in Firefox that says Allow DRM Content and then yes, as far as I know, you need to be using laptop or a HDMI display.
Fine. then use a Roku or Apple TV or whatever. He literally included those.
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I’m not sure why people are so upset.
It’s a little annoying sure, but don’t these work?Do they make DP support HDMI 2.1/2.2?
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Fine. then use a Roku or Apple TV or whatever. He literally included those.
Rokus have the same problem regardless of form factor. But this thread is about people who want to use the Steam Machine for streaming.
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No real technical advantage; it’s just owned by the same shitbags that dominate the TV market, so it’s the only way to connect to a lot of consumer living-room displays
Yes HDMI forum are shitbags, but there are definitely technical advantages to HDMI. Just that I can think of, DisplayPort doesn’t have ARC (audio return for sound systems), or CEC (device can turn on TV/display, TV remote can pause movie playing on console, etc) and the max length for a DisplayPort cable is no more than 3 meters before you have to go to expensive active cables. Most of these are easy to work around for most PC setups, but if Valve wants the gabecube to easily fit into living room/TV setups, it does present a challenge.
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Well Valve should sell an optional DisplayPort adapter then, right?
The Steam Machine is supposed to be plug and play, and not getting VRR on your TV is a huge compromise.
Most people who want plug and play probably don’t know what VRR is.
Heck I don’t fully remember it and I actually learned why it’s nice and would want it.
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My understanding is it’s not even a licensing issue. The HDMI consortium won’t let you include features from 2.1 and 2.2 in an open source driver. it sounds like Valve would be willing to pay, but they’d have to include a closed source driver for the video card.
That’s still a licensing issue: you’re not allowed to license from the HDMI consortium and then freely sublicense to all your users, which is what open source requires. Hopefully this eventually concludes in the end of relevance for HDMI and we can have a freer, and just better ecosystem in general.
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Do they make DP support HDMI 2.1/2.2?
That one I linked does HDMI 2.1
I haven’t seen any that claim 2.2There are also cables with DisplayPort on one end and HDMI on the other. No seperate adapter
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Yes HDMI forum are shitbags, but there are definitely technical advantages to HDMI. Just that I can think of, DisplayPort doesn’t have ARC (audio return for sound systems), or CEC (device can turn on TV/display, TV remote can pause movie playing on console, etc) and the max length for a DisplayPort cable is no more than 3 meters before you have to go to expensive active cables. Most of these are easy to work around for most PC setups, but if Valve wants the gabecube to easily fit into living room/TV setups, it does present a challenge.
All of these supposed advantages are solved by USB-C though. Even the length is higher (5m, I believe). I’d be fine if the DisplayPort connector is gone, but the actual standard is just better for most purposes.
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That one I linked does HDMI 2.1
I haven’t seen any that claim 2.2There are also cables with DisplayPort on one end and HDMI on the other. No seperate adapter
I just don’t trust the claims. Looks like mixed reviews on 2.1 features working.
I wonder what one should actually expect to work in a passive cable/adapter.
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I just don’t trust the claims. Looks like mixed reviews on 2.1 features working.
I wonder what one should actually expect to work in a passive cable/adapter.
Length matters. Off the top of my head I think the spec is for 16’ max. If you’re dasy changing a pair of 10’+ cables on an adapter like that, you might run into problems.
