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Wandering Adventure Party

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  3. An interesting piece about the #ttrpg media landscape: https://personable.blog/media-crowdfunding/

An interesting piece about the #ttrpg media landscape: https://personable.blog/media-crowdfunding/

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  • Strange QuarkS Strange Quark

    @Taskerland That's a nice blog post.

    As I read it, he is not criticising designer-facing media or even crowdfunding, but rather bemoaning the lack of media outlets aimed at ordinary people who just want to know which games are worth playing.

    If he is criticising anything, it would seem to be social media, that has hollowed out the media space for gaming — as it has for all other spheres of news. Social media has replaced traditional journalism and rendered it unprofitable.

    Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
    Moreau Vazh
    wrote last edited by
    #14

    @strangequark Whilst also being completely unfit for purpose.

    I don't mind industry-facing people having news outlets, but I am definitely not a fan of stuff for regular gamers being replaced by industry-facing stuff.

    Strange QuarkS 1 Reply Last reply
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    • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

      @strangequark Whilst also being completely unfit for purpose.

      I don't mind industry-facing people having news outlets, but I am definitely not a fan of stuff for regular gamers being replaced by industry-facing stuff.

      Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
      Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
      Strange Quark
      wrote last edited by
      #15

      @Taskerland To quote my bio, "I started playing RPGs in the 1980s, when the only form of social media was White Dwarf magazine."

      In the early days (first ~100 issues), it was a magazine written by gamers, for gamers. Articles, reviews, a scenario or two, fan-contributed content. There is nothing like that any more.

      Strange QuarkS CharnockP 2 Replies Last reply
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      • Strange QuarkS Strange Quark

        @Taskerland To quote my bio, "I started playing RPGs in the 1980s, when the only form of social media was White Dwarf magazine."

        In the early days (first ~100 issues), it was a magazine written by gamers, for gamers. Articles, reviews, a scenario or two, fan-contributed content. There is nothing like that any more.

        Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
        Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
        Strange Quark
        wrote last edited by
        #16

        @Taskerland Online magazines were possible in the early 2000s. Facebook lured publishers in with a promise to drive more traffic to their sites, but once they were locked in, they did a bait and switch, keeping readers on Facebook. They fed off the work of journalists and bled them dry.

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        • Strange QuarkS Strange Quark

          @Taskerland To quote my bio, "I started playing RPGs in the 1980s, when the only form of social media was White Dwarf magazine."

          In the early days (first ~100 issues), it was a magazine written by gamers, for gamers. Articles, reviews, a scenario or two, fan-contributed content. There is nothing like that any more.

          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
          Charnock
          wrote last edited by
          #17

          Early WD was such a glorious shambles. There were fantastically weird articles. It was nice reading it back to back with Imagine as well. I remember never finding Dragon half as interesting because the professionalism diminished the mentalism

          @strangequark @Taskerland

          Strange QuarkS 1 Reply Last reply
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          • Moreau VazhT Moreau Vazh

            The observations of Rascal are interesting case in point:

            Writer views their crowd-funding coverage as an attempt to cover new releases but the fact that the coverage is never critical and never involves seeing the actual games means that it comes across to me mire as an attempt to court favour with designers.

            For me, this sits in tension with their fondness for producing 'industry watchdog' pieces that you have to pay to read.

            devilsjunkshopD This user is from outside of this forum
            devilsjunkshopD This user is from outside of this forum
            devilsjunkshop
            wrote last edited by
            #18

            @Taskerland It appears I've been ignoring emails from Rascal for months having completely forgotten who they were or why I signed up for that. I don't feel I'm missing out tbh.

            Moreau VazhT 1 Reply Last reply
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            • CharnockP Charnock

              Early WD was such a glorious shambles. There were fantastically weird articles. It was nice reading it back to back with Imagine as well. I remember never finding Dragon half as interesting because the professionalism diminished the mentalism

              @strangequark @Taskerland

              Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
              Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
              Strange Quark
              wrote last edited by
              #19

              @Printdevil Yes. White Dwarf was a beautiful painted cover wrapped around 36 pages of text set in a 5 point font with no margins. Some of the scenarios were genius (Albie Fiore's The Lichway is still my personal favourite) while others were just bonkers. You always had to sift through the dirt to find the gold.

              @Taskerland

              CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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              • Strange QuarkS Strange Quark

                @Printdevil Yes. White Dwarf was a beautiful painted cover wrapped around 36 pages of text set in a 5 point font with no margins. Some of the scenarios were genius (Albie Fiore's The Lichway is still my personal favourite) while others were just bonkers. You always had to sift through the dirt to find the gold.

                @Taskerland

                CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                Charnock
                wrote last edited by
                #20

                It also covered whatever games were on the go without favouritism beyond what people wrote. I quite liked their Barbarian class which always seemed more interesting than the Unearthed Arcana one. Much shouting in the D&D over that.

                Dragon always seemed so bland. A pabulum of gaming.

                @strangequark @Taskerland

                Strange QuarkS Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP 2 Replies Last reply
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                • devilsjunkshopD devilsjunkshop

                  @Taskerland It appears I've been ignoring emails from Rascal for months having completely forgotten who they were or why I signed up for that. I don't feel I'm missing out tbh.

                  Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                  Moreau VazhT This user is from outside of this forum
                  Moreau Vazh
                  wrote last edited by
                  #21

                  @devilsjunkshop I rate some of the people who write for them but they desperately need an actual editor.

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                  • CharnockP Charnock

                    It also covered whatever games were on the go without favouritism beyond what people wrote. I quite liked their Barbarian class which always seemed more interesting than the Unearthed Arcana one. Much shouting in the D&D over that.

                    Dragon always seemed so bland. A pabulum of gaming.

                    @strangequark @Taskerland

                    Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
                    Strange QuarkS This user is from outside of this forum
                    Strange Quark
                    wrote last edited by
                    #22

                    @Printdevil I only realised quite recently that Mark Harrison who drew "The Travellers" in White Dwarf is the same artist who draws "The Out" in 2000 AD. But once I made the connection it's obvious it's the same artist.

                    @Taskerland

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                    • CharnockP Charnock

                      I've seen that dynamic and it lead to a group split, with the experimentalists on one side and a "we play DnD, and CoC" on the other.

                      It was quite amicable, but a lot of it was about people's investment of their time in what they perceived as worthwhile. Some people who only gamed once a week didn't want to play a "might be absolutely trash" game with their one session, and I'm not ill disposed to that reasoning in a short life*

                      *this is a lie, screw them

                      @pteryx @Taskerland

                      FoolishOwlF This user is from outside of this forum
                      FoolishOwlF This user is from outside of this forum
                      FoolishOwl
                      wrote last edited by
                      #23

                      @Printdevil @pteryx @Taskerland I think this has been a basic split in the TTRPG scene since nearly the beginning, though I think indie games have become significantly more popular in recent years.

                      There was the "D20" period, in which they made an earnest effort to generalize D&D's core mechanics. But through most of its history, I think D&D has tended to emphasize its specific or idiosyncratic features. "System mastery" is closely related, but it also plays into something like nostalgia.

                      FoolishOwlF Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP 2 Replies Last reply
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                      • FoolishOwlF FoolishOwl

                        @Printdevil @pteryx @Taskerland I think this has been a basic split in the TTRPG scene since nearly the beginning, though I think indie games have become significantly more popular in recent years.

                        There was the "D20" period, in which they made an earnest effort to generalize D&D's core mechanics. But through most of its history, I think D&D has tended to emphasize its specific or idiosyncratic features. "System mastery" is closely related, but it also plays into something like nostalgia.

                        FoolishOwlF This user is from outside of this forum
                        FoolishOwlF This user is from outside of this forum
                        FoolishOwl
                        wrote last edited by
                        #24

                        @Printdevil @pteryx @Taskerland I saw a general gaming news site feature an article about potential changes to the ranger class in a future D&D edition. That's a big deal if you only play D&D and rangers are your favorite class. From the perspective of most indie games, I think it's kind of assumed that you'll tweak things on the fly and borrow ideas from other games; it wouldn't even make sense to write about a minor change in the text.

                        CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                        • FoolishOwlF FoolishOwl

                          @Printdevil @pteryx @Taskerland I saw a general gaming news site feature an article about potential changes to the ranger class in a future D&D edition. That's a big deal if you only play D&D and rangers are your favorite class. From the perspective of most indie games, I think it's kind of assumed that you'll tweak things on the fly and borrow ideas from other games; it wouldn't even make sense to write about a minor change in the text.

                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                          Charnock
                          wrote last edited by
                          #25

                          "Changes to Rangers" is the sort of thing that youtubers thrive on, and that feeds back into the problem with the hobby.

                          @foolishowl @pteryx @Taskerland

                          Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP 1 Reply Last reply
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                          • CharnockP Charnock

                            "Changes to Rangers" is the sort of thing that youtubers thrive on, and that feeds back into the problem with the hobby.

                            @foolishowl @pteryx @Taskerland

                            Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                            Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                            Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
                            wrote last edited by
                            #26

                            @Printdevil @foolishowl @Taskerland
                            It's worth noting that these sorts tend to also specifically insist that the "ranger problem" is a combat effectiveness problem, and lack both the historical perspective on D&D specifically and the critical mindset generally to question this simplistic view.

                            So even if I played 5e or "5e", most of D&Dtube *still* wouldn't even be that valuable to me.

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                            • Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary

                              @Printdevil @foolishowl @Taskerland
                              It's worth noting that these sorts tend to also specifically insist that the "ranger problem" is a combat effectiveness problem, and lack both the historical perspective on D&D specifically and the critical mindset generally to question this simplistic view.

                              So even if I played 5e or "5e", most of D&Dtube *still* wouldn't even be that valuable to me.

                              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                              CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                              Charnock
                              wrote last edited by
                              #27

                              The whole combat effectiveness type approach to gaming is why I find it hard to chat to local gamers, in a gaming shop, who are gaming.

                              Because it just looks like an RPG

                              But it isn't.

                              @pteryx @foolishowl @Taskerland

                              Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP FoolishOwlF humanadverbH CyC Roger BW 😷R 5 Replies Last reply
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                              • FoolishOwlF FoolishOwl

                                @Printdevil @pteryx @Taskerland I think this has been a basic split in the TTRPG scene since nearly the beginning, though I think indie games have become significantly more popular in recent years.

                                There was the "D20" period, in which they made an earnest effort to generalize D&D's core mechanics. But through most of its history, I think D&D has tended to emphasize its specific or idiosyncratic features. "System mastery" is closely related, but it also plays into something like nostalgia.

                                Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
                                wrote last edited by
                                #28

                                @foolishowl @Printdevil @Taskerland
                                It seems to me like after "d20 System" proved to be an untrustworthy brand, people who just wanted to make a game without caring about the system started seeking out indie systems to hang their game idea on instead (FATE for a time, then PbtA). After that, there was a parallel "just make it 5e" trend. The kinds of idiosyncratic game system options from the '90s never really came back.

                                CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • CharnockP Charnock

                                  The whole combat effectiveness type approach to gaming is why I find it hard to chat to local gamers, in a gaming shop, who are gaming.

                                  Because it just looks like an RPG

                                  But it isn't.

                                  @pteryx @foolishowl @Taskerland

                                  Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                  Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                  Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
                                  wrote last edited by
                                  #29

                                  @Printdevil @foolishowl @Taskerland
                                  I've run into that issue too, where despite having *met someone through a freeform RP community*, I *still* couldn't really talk with him about D&D because he was frankly off on another planet as far as what the basic nature of the game was. (I could talk with his *husband*, but then he died, so...)

                                  CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary

                                    @Printdevil @foolishowl @Taskerland
                                    I've run into that issue too, where despite having *met someone through a freeform RP community*, I *still* couldn't really talk with him about D&D because he was frankly off on another planet as far as what the basic nature of the game was. (I could talk with his *husband*, but then he died, so...)

                                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                    Charnock
                                    wrote last edited by
                                    #30

                                    I killed most of my friends irl as well. I'm working on @devilsjunkshop and @strangequark at the moment...

                                    @pteryx @foolishowl @Taskerland

                                    Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP 1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary

                                      @foolishowl @Printdevil @Taskerland
                                      It seems to me like after "d20 System" proved to be an untrustworthy brand, people who just wanted to make a game without caring about the system started seeking out indie systems to hang their game idea on instead (FATE for a time, then PbtA). After that, there was a parallel "just make it 5e" trend. The kinds of idiosyncratic game system options from the '90s never really came back.

                                      CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                      CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                      Charnock
                                      wrote last edited by
                                      #31

                                      I'm a huge fan of the FGU games of the 1980s

                                      @pteryx @foolishowl @Taskerland

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                                      • CharnockP Charnock

                                        I killed most of my friends irl as well. I'm working on @devilsjunkshop and @strangequark at the moment...

                                        @pteryx @foolishowl @Taskerland

                                        Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP This user is from outside of this forum
                                        Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary
                                        wrote last edited by
                                        #32

                                        @Printdevil @devilsjunkshop @strangequark @foolishowl @Taskerland
                                        Look, the only person I ever joke about having killed I've never even *met* IRL (the "leader and detective" player from my Eberron superhero campaign back in the day, if you've read that blog post).

                                        This guy was wheelchair-bound and very accident-prone (as in people tended to ram into him with cars), though oddly it was other medical complications that killed him. Wish I could've gotten to know him more, but...

                                        CharnockP 1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • Pteryx the Puzzle SecretaryP Pteryx the Puzzle Secretary

                                          @Printdevil @devilsjunkshop @strangequark @foolishowl @Taskerland
                                          Look, the only person I ever joke about having killed I've never even *met* IRL (the "leader and detective" player from my Eberron superhero campaign back in the day, if you've read that blog post).

                                          This guy was wheelchair-bound and very accident-prone (as in people tended to ram into him with cars), though oddly it was other medical complications that killed him. Wish I could've gotten to know him more, but...

                                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                          CharnockP This user is from outside of this forum
                                          Charnock
                                          wrote last edited by
                                          #33

                                          I'm just of an age that people ... aren't there anymore, because of all the mortal reasons time brings with.

                                          @pteryx @devilsjunkshop @strangequark @foolishowl @Taskerland

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