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Wandering Adventure Party

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  3. An excellent essay by @pluralistic , as always.

An excellent essay by @pluralistic , as always.

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uspoliticsvoteblue
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  • Metalpoet :pentagram:M Metalpoet :pentagram:

    @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

    There's an old saying: when people fear their government, that's tyranny. When government's fear the people: that's freedom.

    This doesn't mean you should be a violent threat to the government (at least outside of rare and exceptional circumstances: violent revolutions very rarely have good outcomes so are almost never worth the risk), in every normal moment, every politician needs to be extremely afraid he won't be there after the next election.

    That's the only way to get good leadership.

    And no, corp dems had nothing to with the relatively less damaging Trump 1st term.

    jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
    jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
    jz.tusk
    wrote last edited by
    #8

    @metalpoetnl @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

    2021-2024 was not Trump's first term.

    Love Europeans, but so many of them know nothing about American politics, or about how to survive with a massive population that is content with racist fascism.

    Metalpoet :pentagram:M 2 Replies Last reply
    0
    • Metalpoet :pentagram:M Metalpoet :pentagram:

      @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic
      I will tell you why the 1st Trump term wasn't as bad: because nobody thought he would win.
      The nutjobs had no infrastructure to make his insanity come to fruition. The civil service was filled with people who are employed for skill, not loyalty, who refused to implement outright insane or illegal ideas.

      It was, overwhelmingly, NON-politicians (let alone corporate ones) that prevented his worst instincts happening.

      In 2024 - with the real possiblity of winning there was Project 2025: and it's most important clause: mass firings in the civil service and politicising non-political posts.

      Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
      Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
      Metalpoet :pentagram:
      wrote last edited by
      #9

      @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic
      So this time what's left of the civil service is stuffed entirely with sycophants who happily do whatever Trump wants - regardless if it's sane, sensible or legal.

      Now you have an EPA that considers profit impacts of regulations but does NOT consider how many lives it would save.

      Now you have a labor relations board that is effectively unable to function.
      A CFPB that's been basically neutered.

      This time the craziest of the crazies in America knew he COULD win, and they were ready to provide the infrastructure to support his vision and destroy the infrastructure to oppose it.

      That is what is REALLY different.

      jz.tuskJ 1 Reply Last reply
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      • Jürgen HubertJ Jürgen Hubert

        @jztusk @pluralistic

        Corpo Democrats do not prevent fascism, they only delay it. I remember how #DefundThePolice was called for, yet Democrats still expanded police forces, including ICE.

        Link Preview Image
        How ICE grew to be the highest-funded U.S. law enforcement agency

        ICE's budget hovered around $10 billion for years. But President Trump and the Republican-controlled Congress are taking the agency's funding to unprecedented levels.

        favicon

        NPR (www.npr.org)

        jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
        jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
        jz.tusk
        wrote last edited by
        #10

        @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

        Delay matters. People should vote blue every November. Do you dispute that?

        Jürgen HubertJ 1 Reply Last reply
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        • Metalpoet :pentagram:M Metalpoet :pentagram:

          @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic
          I will tell you why the 1st Trump term wasn't as bad: because nobody thought he would win.
          The nutjobs had no infrastructure to make his insanity come to fruition. The civil service was filled with people who are employed for skill, not loyalty, who refused to implement outright insane or illegal ideas.

          It was, overwhelmingly, NON-politicians (let alone corporate ones) that prevented his worst instincts happening.

          In 2024 - with the real possiblity of winning there was Project 2025: and it's most important clause: mass firings in the civil service and politicising non-political posts.

          jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
          jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
          jz.tusk
          wrote last edited by
          #11

          @metalpoetnl @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

          Again, I am not taking about Trump's first administration.

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • Metalpoet :pentagram:M Metalpoet :pentagram:

            @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic
            So this time what's left of the civil service is stuffed entirely with sycophants who happily do whatever Trump wants - regardless if it's sane, sensible or legal.

            Now you have an EPA that considers profit impacts of regulations but does NOT consider how many lives it would save.

            Now you have a labor relations board that is effectively unable to function.
            A CFPB that's been basically neutered.

            This time the craziest of the crazies in America knew he COULD win, and they were ready to provide the infrastructure to support his vision and destroy the infrastructure to oppose it.

            That is what is REALLY different.

            jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
            jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
            jz.tusk
            wrote last edited by
            #12

            @metalpoetnl @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

            Fuck it, muted.

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • jz.tuskJ jz.tusk

              @metalpoetnl @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

              2021-2024 was not Trump's first term.

              Love Europeans, but so many of them know nothing about American politics, or about how to survive with a massive population that is content with racist fascism.

              Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
              Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
              Metalpoet :pentagram:
              wrote last edited by
              #13

              @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic
              the worst thing Americans do is dismiss political insights from anyone who isn't ALSO an American.

              Sorry, everything I told you is absolute facts. Stuff that are verifable and testable.
              Things that provably happened.

              If the democrats had hung on to the house or the senate it would have made ZERO difference: The Trump admin has only passed a SINGLE bill !

              Just one !

              Literally EVERYTHING else he's done has been on ENTIRELY with executive, NOT legislative power and WITHOUT congress getting a say.

              The people who COULD stop some of it, who DID stop it before: Elon fired them all in the first month.

              1 Reply Last reply
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              • jz.tuskJ jz.tusk

                @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                Delay matters. People should vote blue every November. Do you dispute that?

                Jürgen HubertJ This user is from outside of this forum
                Jürgen HubertJ This user is from outside of this forum
                Jürgen Hubert
                wrote last edited by
                #14

                @jztusk @pluralistic

                I do not.

                But real change must come in the Primaries. Otherwise the USA will simply continue to alternate between "slow-walking fascism" and "speed-running fascism".

                jz.tuskJ 1 Reply Last reply
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                • jz.tuskJ jz.tusk

                  @metalpoetnl @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                  2021-2024 was not Trump's first term.

                  Love Europeans, but so many of them know nothing about American politics, or about how to survive with a massive population that is content with racist fascism.

                  Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
                  Metalpoet :pentagram:M This user is from outside of this forum
                  Metalpoet :pentagram:
                  wrote last edited by
                  #15

                  @jztusk @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                  I did misread that, but you know what, that's STILL wrong.

                  Sure you didn't have "this shit" under Biden, but you STILL had massive suffering.

                  If you didn't, Trump 2 would never have happened.

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • jz.tuskJ jz.tusk

                    @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                    #VoteBlue is what you do in November, when the choice might be down to some stale corporate Democrat versus some Republican fascist.

                    > Because it won't do much if those elected Democrats are not afraid of the wrath of the voters each and every time they give in to Trump and the other oligarchs.

                    This is utterly wrong. 2021-2024 we didn't have this shit, and a bunch of corp Dems being in control is why. That made a fucking difference.

                    KichaeK Offline
                    KichaeK Offline
                    Kichae
                    Forum Master
                    wrote last edited by
                    #16

                    jz.tusk

                    2021-2024 we didn’t have this shit

                    Sure you did. It just wasn’t happening to white folks within your borders, so nobody gave a shit. What you’re seeing now is the face of the US outside of the country, y’all just never had to see it.

                    This is the face of the US to non-whites, y’all just never cared enough to do something about it.

                    All that’s happened is that they finally crossed a line that is moved white folks to action. But that’s just a matter of degrees, not types.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • Jürgen HubertJ Jürgen Hubert

                      @jztusk @pluralistic

                      I do not.

                      But real change must come in the Primaries. Otherwise the USA will simply continue to alternate between "slow-walking fascism" and "speed-running fascism".

                      jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
                      jz.tusk
                      wrote last edited by
                      #17

                      @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                      Excellent! Do you know how many people there are spouting off against "Vote Blue", didn't vote for Kamala Harris over Trump because "purity", and are still defending that decision? And your slamming "Vote Blue" reinforces their self-sabotaging ideas.

                      I agree primaries are the strongest place to get better Dems. Plus people need to keep after their elected officials during their terms. ...

                      jz.tuskJ 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • jz.tuskJ jz.tusk

                        @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                        Excellent! Do you know how many people there are spouting off against "Vote Blue", didn't vote for Kamala Harris over Trump because "purity", and are still defending that decision? And your slamming "Vote Blue" reinforces their self-sabotaging ideas.

                        I agree primaries are the strongest place to get better Dems. Plus people need to keep after their elected officials during their terms. ...

                        jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
                        jz.tuskJ This user is from outside of this forum
                        jz.tusk
                        wrote last edited by
                        #18

                        @juergen_hubert @pluralistic

                        Everyone I know IRL is "vote blue". None of them thinks doing only that is enough.

                        Elections are all about mass numbers of people. Crapping on "vote blue" without emphasizing that yes, you still need to do that, while you are also doing more - too many people follow that into apathy. It's a bad strategy for fighting fascism.

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