I've always thought the GM (with the help of the rules) is the lens through which players interact and view a fiction. All the showmanship, all the props, the voices, the acting, the writing, the narratives, and notes, are all just a user interface to allow the players to become part of a fiction. Shared certainly, but assuredly a fiction. The Dice as well exist to pander a little to Eris, and I think to make the GM smile as their own NPCs plans "Gang aft agley"

@Taskerland @RogerBW

I've always thought the GM (with the help of the rules) is the lens through which players interact and view a fiction. All the showmanship, all the props, the voices, the acting, the writing, the narratives, and notes, are all just a user interface to allow the players to become part of a fiction. Shared certainly, but assuredly a fiction. The Dice as well exist to pander a little to Eris, and I think to make the GM smile as their own NPCs plans "Gang aft agley"

@Taskerland @RogerBW

@Printdevil Nah, that's just the reality. We should ignore the reality in favour of seeing the world as a reality, and everything else as a lense.

Basically, Knightmare, but with more people in helmets and one poor sod shouting at them that something's about to eat them.
@Taskerland @RogerBW

@Taskerland I think that "statblocks" "the game is in the numbers crowd" have always existed. There's a very significant crowd of frothing "I've been playing with the white books" crowd who reject utterly the game as fiction played. They have a whole post hoc ergo propter hoc thing going on, where they mythologise the games they have been in afterwards and sit telling stories *about the games*

That's one of the reasons I think they seek to reinstate what it was like when they were 14 again.

Plato's Dystopian Cave Network.

@malin @Taskerland @RogerBW

@Printdevil Back in the day, I used to associate that mindset with a kind of narrow blustering masculinity...

Forget feelings and telling stories, that's all a bit poofy: Give me piles of corpses and magical swords with spikes on them.

What's interesting is that while the incipient misogyny and homophobia have mostly dropped out of sight, there is still a profound resistance to the idea of RPGs being something creative and arty.

@Taskerland I have had this argument over and over with people regarding any break from the proscribed D&D rotes as "forcing authorial proxies by the GM"

These people run terrible games, so I don't really care.

@Printdevil It's a similar mindset to the people who are most vocally against photography being an art-form: No no no... it's all about refractive indexes and hyperfocal distances.

@Taskerland Yes. Everything has rules, and you can find the rule, and reduce it a system you can replicate. Everyone is a behaviour engine. Aesthetics are programmable, and wine tasters make it up.

@Printdevil Now that's just crying out to be an OSR megadungeon.

"the people carrying objects along the wall casting shadows fight as ogre-mages"

@malin @RogerBW

I think there's definitely a fierce crowd of gamers who want it to be about an abstracted table based game at which you can win reward loops through aggressive exploitation of the rules and tactical use of increasing character power. I don't perceive that as roleplaying. It's stat grooming onanism.

@Taskerland @RogerBW

@Ashigaru I don't watch RPG YouTube, I am talking about places like reddit and bluesky.

@Taskerland @Ashigaru Hooboy, YT’s a real freakshow. You’re missing out!

I’m barely on Bluesky, FWIW, and I’ve taught myself to downvote on Reddit and move on, instead of letting the idiots drag me down to their level. Also, I avoid the more theorycrafty subs, stick to those specific to particular games, and block bad-faith actors early and often.

That said, there’s a rhetorical adage that if you’ve nothing to say, say it LOUD! (1/2)

@Printdevil @Taskerland @RogerBW rollplaying vs roleplaying is the oldest divide I know of in the hobby.

Plenty of people who really want to be wargamers when they're meant to be playing an RPG and plenty of people who craft backstories for their disposable Tyrannid hordes when they are wargaming.

@Printdevil Stat blocks, grids, and combat procedures matter. Everything else is immaterial.

@Taskerland @Printdevil So, wargames? They’re in the wrong hobby.

@davej Yes, but they could say the same of me 'Go and join a writing workshop!' - I am just depressed that live-and-let-live is not in the vocabulary of people who have been relentlessly indulged by the entire hobby for decades now. @Printdevil

@Colman This is what frustrates me a lot of the time. We know that there are different tastes within the hobby, we know that people enjoy different things, and yet we can never escape the people screaming about how you're an idiot if you think that rules are nothing but scaffolding backed by the social dynamics that actually shape play. @Printdevil @RogerBW

@Printdevil @Taskerland @RogerBW rollplaying vs roleplaying is the oldest divide I know of in the hobby.

Plenty of people who really want to be wargamers when they're meant to be playing an RPG and plenty of people who craft backstories for their disposable Tyrannid hordes when they are wargaming.

@davej Yes, but they could say the same of me 'Go and join a writing workshop!' - I am just depressed that live-and-let-live is not in the vocabulary of people who have been relentlessly indulged by the entire hobby for decades now. @Printdevil